I don’t know whether this has been poted elsewhere, but I saw this on ‘Battlestations’ this morning:
Fixed.
Jus t so that there’s no misunderstanding, no sarcasm intended, above.
Definition:
pukka also puck·a (pk)
adj.
-
Genuine; authentic.
-
Superior; first-class.
Another puck.a, and an entirely military one.
Puckapunyal
One of the best known military camps in Australia, Puckapunyal Camp, widely-known simply as “Pucka”, opened in November 1939 to accommodate troops of the 17th Brigade of the 6th Australian Division. It was one of several new camps built for the concentration and training of the Second AIF because existing military facilities were already occupied by militia units. Initially 5,714 hectares of grazing land were compulsory acquired just to the west of the town of Seymour (96 kilometres north of Melbourne); Seymour had been a site for military training since the late 1800s. The camp’s name was derived from the name of a large hill within the field training area, today known as Mount Puckapunyal. Puckapunyal is an English rendering of an Aboriginal word the meaning of which is obscure. It has been variously translated as “death to the eagle”, “the outer barbarians”, “the middle hill”, “place of exile”, and “valley of the winds”. The camp facilities at Puckapunyal were spartan at first - consisting primarily of unlined, windowless corrugated iron huts - but were progressively improved as the war continued. Both AIF and militia units were trained there, and the camp was also home to several Army schools. Puckapunyal remains in use by the Australian Army today and the field training area now encompasses almost 40,000 hectares. Since the Second World War a wide array of units, of both the regular and reserve, have been based at Puckapunyal or used it for training. It remains best known, however, as the home of the Royal Australian Armoured Corps, the first units of which moved there in February 1941.
http://www.awm.gov.au/units/place_557.asp
…
facilities at Puckapunyal were spartan at first - consisting primarily of unlined, windowless corrugated iron huts - but were progressively improved as the war continued.
So, Pucka beame real pukka. :lol:
You’re right Rising sun, Kiwi’s barely get a mention, and the Brazilians even less.
I’m no expert on the Kiwis though: as a kid I was always interested in the tanks, and planes, and basically, NZ had none, when it actually mattered.
That left infantry weapons, then submarines as next choices of study, and what info I picked up on Kiwis derives from there, where it doesn’t derive from direct sources, such as an Uncle who was fighting in El Alamein, Crete and Monte Cassino, and says he met Brazilians, later in Italy.
To topic, now. It is, Imho, completely reasonable to say that such armour as did see employ in the pacific was generally dated and of lesser specification than the armour in use elsewhere, though a case could very well be made on the behalf of the humble Matilda tank, which the Australians not only used effectively in its’ Close Support 3-inch Howitzer version, but as a FlameThrower and Bulldozer tank as well.
Many of those vehicles did survive postwar, and some were used as Driver Training Vehicles until 1953, as I understand it.
(Pictures : The Semple “tank” :: State of the art in AFV’s, NZ, circa 1940.)
Regards, Uyraell.
Sad thing is, most of the posts in Germany were closed, and returned to the German Gov’t. No idea what happened to the vehicles displayed in them. There was in my Kaserne the point tank from the relief of Bastogne, Cobra King by name. No one who was posted there seems to know what became of it. My guess is they were moved to remaining posts, or scrapped.
TG,
That great evil, “Political Correctness”, would have to be blamed.
There is, Imo, a concerted effort in either denying the realities of history to the young who walk this earth after us, or in so distorting that same history as to make it valueless.
As an amatuer though reasonably knowledgeable Historian, this trend saddens me greatly…
Regards, Uyraell.
Regards, Uyraell
Ulyraell, I totally agree. As a 10yr old, I accompanied my father to Osnabruck, on the North German plain. Where I beheld boys of my age shouting “Heil Hitler!” and giving Nazi salutes as they passed us in the street. It would have been naive of us to expect “de-Nazification” to have been totally accepted by a shell-shocked and bewildered population. But the fist fights I got into were unmistakeably political. What price political correctness in 1957?
In 1964, I spent a few weeks in Berlin, where the local attitude to the British was totally different. Don’t know if the close proximity of the Russians had anything to do with it - but the Brits certainly boosted the local economy.
Cheers,
Cliff
Rommel rated the New Zealand Division as the best Commonwealth (including the Brits) troops his men faced in North Africa. Maori troops would do insane things - like reaching up from a trench after a tank had rolled over it, and dropping a grenade inside the track; once the vehicle had been stopped, the Maori would swarm all over it, shooting the crew, dropping more grenades down the crew hatch, generally disabling the vehicle. The Kiwis punched well above their weight. Brazilians? wtf? More info required.
Cheers,
Cliff
Sindat and more Tanks.
Ken Cooper : The Little Men.
Another unit in the Brigade had got a prisoner and it looked as if the Japanse facing us were the 33rd (Sendai) Division. When this particular division had failed to break through into Imphal the previous year it had lost heavily: but its constant suicide attacks had been so remarkable for their boldness, even for the Japanese, that it had been no surprise when we discovered that it was regarded as a ‘crack’ division. There can be few examples in history of a force as reduced, battered and exhausted as the Sendai division continuing to deliver such furious assaults; and this, not in order to fight its way out of an untenable position to save its own skin, but in order to achieve the original objectives set for it. It was obvious that here, behind the Irrawady river line, the Sendai division was as determined and as fanatical as ever and, more likely, reinforced with troops of a similar calibre.
One of Major General Tanaka’s regiments was the redoubtable 214 Infantry, the Byaka Tai - White Tigers, as they called themselves - and they were probably the most ferociously barbarous bunch of soldiers ever to wear a uniform in modern history…
…In the daylight hours, between sporadic shelling, patrolling and the never-ending fatigues, we stood in the trenches about Alethaung and gazed mesmerised across the expanse of no-man’s-land towards the compelling prospect of Sindat…
…One morning we heard the unaccustomed roar of giant engines and the rumbling and clancking of steel tacks approaching from the west. When a squadron of General Lee tanks harboured nearby…
…In the morning we went over to the tank laager to familarise ourselves with the technicalities of communication between tank and infantry. We were shown the telephones kept in containers under the armour plating at the back of each tank…
…One of the most popular methods we finally agreed on was that of indicating targets for the tanks’ gunners by firing tracer bullets (to appraoch a tank under fire would invite a scragging from every enemy weapon in the vicinity). But the crews were pretty blind behind their steel walls: in the event we expected to be forced on occassion to use the tank telephones anyway.
We could imagine ourselves:“Look here, old man, turn a bit to the left, so that you can see our tracers indicating the target for you.”…
…A few Jap shells came over, aimed no doubt at the tanks, but near enough to us to make us duck and flinch. We moved restlessly as showersof earth and stones flung up across the paddyfields. The tank squadron was down now, out of sight in the bottom of a chaung. We could hear the engines roaring as flames and blue smoke belched from their exhausts into the air.
We waited expectantly. One tank roared into sight, balanced precariously on the bank of the chaung and slammed forward onto its tracks. It was the leading troop-commander who came over next, head and shoulders exposed above his turret, earphones firmly clamped over the back of his black beret on his head. I stood up and went to his tank a few yards away from the platoon. Looking down into the chaung I was horrified, though hardly surprised, to see the remaining ten tanks of the squadron churning deeper and deeper into the mire. The frustrated commanders gesticulated and cursed above the roar of the engines.
“Biggest balls-up since the Somme,” I shouted down at them. The explosive hissing chatter of machine guns and the flurry of shelling in front swelled as the bombardment reached its climax…
“Advance…!”
Bullets began to crack and hiss about us like swarms of hornets. Shell-bursts spewed rubble between groups of crouching men. We covered the ravaged dust of no-man’s-land in a state of mental suspension, the two tanks amongst us bobbing up and down over the paddy bunds like cavalry at the trot…
…The two tanks rolled along between my platoon and the remainder of the Company, their guns barking at intervals. In front of the tanks crept a wave of fire as the artillery barrage lifted and dropped again into the village…
…We swung left towards Sindat, snap-shooting at a crowd of Japanese. Some of them were carrying wounded comrades on their backs and running for the shelter of the trees.
The paltoon went in after them.
“Spread out! Spread out! Don’t bunch!”…Enemy troops were running about hither and thither to escape the flaming bamboo building falling in on their tenches and dugouts. We shot them down…
…A Jap grenade burst at my feet and I felt tiny fragments slash into the calvs of my legs. There was a burning sensation under my left arm.
I yelped and dived for the ground. Feeling a further pain, I got up and remembered to put my helmet back on my head. I caught a gimpse of Smithie’s scared face.
“It’s OK. High fragmentation, no sweat, let’s go on.”Through a gap in the trees we could see one of the tanks on fire in a clearing. I caught a glimpse of two of the crew crouching in the open and firing their sten guns.
“This way, this way over here. Ther’s a gap. Come on, come on.”
…The men seemed to be suddenly consumed by a vast black savagery. We got up whooping triumphantly, and charged through a narrow gap in the wall of flame. Beyond the burning tank some Japs were falling back, turning to fire and bomb as they went. The platoon went after them in a solid scrum. Near the end of the village the Japs attempted to regroup. We saw for the first time an anti-tank gun. Two diminutive Japs in full kit were swinging across the gigantic barrel to counter-balance the weight of the trail, which was being manhandled by what Iassumed to be the gun-crew. There were half a dozen others covering them and snap-shooting at us. We rushed on them without pause, drunk with the intoxication of killing and destroying, our minds focussed on getting forward. When the blood lust faded seconds later there were Japanes lying all ways, some in shell craters their legs sticking out, others huddled against trees, most of them still, but a few jerking in horrible spasms, trying to get up, or turn over, or drag themselves on their hands. Their final attempt at defiance had been so bereft of the enemy’s usual ferocity that I was awe-struck and incredulous. It had been almost too easy…
The Road To Mandalay
Not sure about the white star insignia?
There is an Osprey New Vanguard book about the M3 Lee/Grant.
In April 1941 the Indian 1st (later 251st) armoured brigade received a hand full of Grandt’s, while the 2nd, later 252nd, received both Lee’s and Grant’s.The 251st got M-4 A4 Shermans before going into action, and the 252nd went to Persia with the 31st armoured division with 2 regiments of Grants, and then moved into Iraq were they were given Shermans in May '43.
The 254th Indian tank brigade however started to get Grants and Lee’s in the summer of 1943 for 2 of their regiments, 3rd Carabiniers and 150 Regiment RAC. Both regiments fought at Kohima and Imphal in 44-45. Also, 25th Dragoons went into action with their Lee`s along the burmees coast when the second Arakan offencive took place, and two squadrons were enclosed in a box at Sinzewa with 7 division by the Japanees Ha-Go attack. The remaining squadron supported the 5th division to relieve the box. In February 1944 crews started experimenting with defences against magnetic mines, who could penetrate roof and rear armour of the Lee.
3rd Carabiniers successes in Burma let for a call for new Lee unids, and these were created. 3rd Carabiniers and 150 reg. RAC remained with their Lee’s, as did some new employed, sutch as the new 146 reg. RAC, and possibly 149 reg. RAC, but I can’t be sure of the last regiment.
Also in the book are some profiles, and for the Burma campaign, there are two.
- A Lee of C squadron 3rd Carabiniers in Burma in '44, with the longer 75mm barrel, a red circle with troop number on the rear of the turred side, smoke lauchers on the left turred side, mech screen over the engine deck, and a large hand pained star on the left front side, just in front of the door.
- A Lee of C squadron 150th reg. RAC, Burma 1945.
This Lee has a blue circle on the rear of the turred side, sandbags on the engine deck, a name unther the driver’s side vision port (In this case CALEDONIAN.), tracks welded to the front plates, a iron plate over the tracks just unther the left acces door, and a small white star just before the left acces door. This tank also shows the remainders of smoke launchers at the left side of the turred.
These profiles are only of the left side, and of the 2 photo’s of Lee’s in Burma, one if from the left front side, and the other tank from the right, but this tank has large woden poles attached to the side, so no telling about the right side markings…
Does anyone know what type of hatch the British Lee’s had? Were they sherman hatches?
Essentially, the turret cupola hatch was the same as on a Sherman M4.
at least, that is as I understand the topic. There are variations in details such as internal locking latches, but unless you are doing an extremely detailed scale model, these are minor matters.
Regards, Uyraell.
Essentially, the turret cupola hatch was the same as on a Sherman M4.
At least, that is as I understand the topic. There are variations in details such as internal locking latches, but unless you are doing an extremely detailed scale model, these are minor matters.
Regards, Uyraell.
Which demonstrates my point about their contribution being ignored.
Although it’s not my favourite source, Wiki gives a fair account here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_Expeditionary_Force_(FEB)#Curios
Brazil also contributed various land bases within Brazil to the Allied effort.
From memory, by an Agreement, the white Star insignia became Standard Allied Recognition pattern by about the time of the Sicily landings.
Wiser heads than mine may be able to confirm that.
Warm Regards, Uyraell.
According to the Osprey book, white stars were carried on the left side, as is confirmed by a photo of a Lee from C squadron, 150th reg. RAC, named CALEDONIAN. No information is given about the right side, but I suspect the star was there.
Cheers,
Joppe
The British also used Shermans. Particular in the capture and defence of Meiktila:
[i]A Squadron Probyn’s Horse 255th Tank Brigade (attached) – reinforcement – start rolling turn 4
1 Command Sherman
1 Sherman
1 Recce Humber Mk-IV – attached from 16th Light Cavalry
1 Infantry Stand – attached from B Coy 4/4th Bombay Grenadiers
1 15cwt Truck[/i]
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/reader/1841766984/ref=sib_dp_pt#reader-link
I think the picture in the link confirms the use of the white star by allied troops?
Jup. I have a book called: The hell of Burma. (It’s in Dutch). In it, are a few photo’s of armour. One of them is a M3A1 Stuart tank with an aparantly Indian crew. On the next photo, there is a convoy, with at least two Sherman III’s. The AoS is 53, on an apparent red square, and a white line unthernead. Then next are two trucks, (one of them might be a Dodge WC-51 or 52, any confirmation on this?), and then there is another Sherman III. It’s far away and a bit behind a cloud of dust, but it seems to have a white star on the hull side.
Also in the book is a photo of a M-7 Priest 105 self propelled howitzer, with a crew running towards it. The crew weares Australian hats, and the landscape seems like that on a Burmees plain…
Hope this is of any relevance.
Cheers,
Joppe