Sorry, been away for a while Flammpanzer! The whole SS organization never impressed me. The cultic mentality of the organization OVER ALL & FAVORTISIM by their boss in superior numbers/quality of equipment, better pay etc. shows me little in being an elite organization. Their “hard fought” battles against unarmed citizens including women & children brings about as much meaning to the term “elite soldiers” as does general custer’s so called “elite calvery” troops slaughter of unarmed/starved indians during the late 1800’s in America.
I mean look at the comparrison’s Flampanzer, & tell me if I’m not correct. Take the Africa Korps for example. Just ordinary Wehrmacht troops, right? WRONG!!! Under general Rommel’s command originally these “ordinary” Wehrmacht troops did BECOME elite! General Rommel, in my opinion, was the FINEST field commander to command an army in all of WW2 bar none!!! Both his strategic/tactical skills were absolutly unequaled & coupled with a “sixth sence”, BRAVERY/BRAVADO & cunningness he brought new meaning to the words “elite military unit”! I mean my God, even the allies wished they had him on their side. If general Rommel had been working for Britan instead of general Montgomery, hitler’s third reich would have been over run in 1943!!! Flammpanzer, look closly at the following facts…the Africa Corps was operating on a hostile climated land mass seperated by a contested sea. ALL supplies had to be ferried across this sea to the DAK by an increasingly incompetent/hesitant Italian navy. Supplies became increasingly short in number as the conflict dragged on. A lack of these supplies coupled with allied air/naval/infantry/armour/artillery supperiority & every thing else needed by an army simply over whelmed the DAK through ATTRITION.
So successful & so serious was the threat of the DAK that they tied up the entire British European army. I mean the British had to enlist New Zealand/Australian troops to help stem general Rommels outrageous successe’s. Still this was not enough as the DAK handled the British/Common Wealth troops with ridiculous ease despite allied superiority in all supplies & quanity of weapons of war then available including naval/air bombardment.
The DAK had become SO ELITE that the Americans had to initiate “operation torch” in the rears of the DAK to destroy them. Still the DAK came on & boxxed the ears of the American troops at Kasserine pass, leaving many Americans imprisoned & the survivors running around like frightened children! Flammepanzer, how could you fail to recognize general Rommel & the DAK as truly elite soldiers when compared to the Wafen SS who always could count on the Wehrmacht/Luftwaffe for support when engaged in operations??? Who could general Rommel & the DAK count on for support? The Italians were it, & I’m NOT cutting down the Italian’s, but the Italian’s were the reason general Rommel ended up leading the DAK into north africa in the first place. The italians being overpowered/overrun by spear wielding Ethiopians gives an account to the combat worthiness of the Italian troops Rommel & the DAK could count on for support.
Flammpanzer, the DAK was/is an elite combat corps because they earned it through performance. Against impossable odds, fighting in EXTREME conditions & ISOLATED general Rommel & the DAK tied up the ENTIRE EUROPIAN ALLIED COMBINED RESOURCES including most air resources & all the NAVAL/LAND FORCES COMBINED!!!
You want the elite of the elite regarding German elite troops during WW2? Just look at a little known “small” battle on an island named Crete. The success of the German paratroops/mountain troops engaged in this struggle is second to none during all theaters of operation in WW2 including the allied operations. Again, against seemingly impossable odds, these “ELITE” soldiers kicked the British/Common Wealth troops not only completly out of Europe but humiliated the British empire big time. I mean when those paratroops/mountain soldiers got thru with them, the survivors were so demoralized that they were only fit for modeling panties & bra’s!!!
There’s more to an “elite” military organization than just a fancy uniform, great pay, square bashing & being told that “your a bunch of super men”!!! Sure the Waffen SS fought & fought hard, at least on the eastern front, but compare their success’s with general Rommel & the DAK or the paratroops/mountain soldiers during the Crete operation & you should easily be able to pick out the difference!
One last note tho not related to the above subject…the way general Rommel faced his death was just another example of his QUALITY of person. To save hardship on others he took his own life with out a squabble. I beleive he would have done this also for even the lowliest private in the DAK. General Rommel was not just a great commander, he was a courageous soldier with the highest of moral standings ADMIRED by both sides in that conflict. No wonder the DAK pulled off the impossable so many, many times!
thanks for your detailed post, bear. but again, I have to point out some things. I have never said or stated before, that the fallschirmjäger or some other troops like the DAK are no elite troop when you look close at them. but in your statement, you act like the W-SS ONLY “fought” against civilians, that is not true. sure, there were a lot of crimes that happened and the W-SS had to be judged for that. furthermore, I NEVER would say that the W-SS IS AN ELITE FORMATION BECAUSE IT EXECUTED CIVILIANS. that would be sick … again: as far as I look at the information of battle-effectiveness, the W-SS was in most cases a better enemy for the allies than most wehrmacht-troops. I would say the paras were equal.
it is interesting that so many are trying to put the W-SS down as a children-slaughtering hord of criminals (indeed, most were!) with hardly any value on the battlefield. I still do not believe that at all.
jens
He shows some W-SS Equippement
Click
PS: And i found this - he shows some Fallschirmjäger Equippement
Click
Yeah, I’ve seen that stuff. Pretty cool, ain’t it?
The SS also carried out mass killings of the British rear guard at Dunkirk.
The Glosters, Stafordshires, Warwicshires and many of the Royal Regiment of Artillery, among others, were killed in “revenge” for putting up a fight.
It is worth noting that in most cases the units that had taken the brunt of the resistance treated the British with respect. They were then passed BACK to the SS for guarding and imprisonment.
In “revenge” they were herded in to barns and grenaded or machine gunned in ditches.
Elite? Doing a soldiers job? No, they were idiots with diseased minds, and that disease was the Nazi cults ethos and beliefs. Non of the SS can be admired, even the recruits from other nations were generally the scum of that countries earth (ie the Bosnias and Serbs, Romanians etc).
Oh, this brings up an argument. I’d have to disagree with you.
Most young men joined the Waffen-SS as a fighting force because they were more well equipped than the Wehrmacht, and they offered better pay. Most of the SS were doing soldier jobs, and yes, they were elite. Everyone country commits a war crime. And yes, I do look down on the Waffen-Schutzstaffel for actions at Dunkirk.
But, over a six year war, the say… 100, at most, Waffen-SS soldiers who massacred the BEF at Dunkirk doesn’t mean the thousands of other SS over the time span of the war
were idiots with diseased minds, and that disease was the Nazi cults ethos and beliefs
And because of Hollywood, and people spreading the idea that the entire SS were ‘Goose Stepping Goones dressed in black and murdering every ‘unwanted’ individual they see’ makes me go crazy.
My great uncle was in the W-SS in the Eastern Front and faught to the death untill he was wounded. Never, ever (And he still lives by this) did he ever see any of his comrades or himself commit acts of genocide or war crimes.
Hope you get the picture 
Oh, this brings up an argument. I’d have to disagree with you.
Most young men joined the Waffen-SS as a fighting force because they were more well equipped than the Wehrmacht, and they offered better pay. Most of the SS were doing soldier jobs, and yes, they were elite. Everyone country commits a war crime. And yes, I do look down on the Waffen-Schutzstaffel for actions at Dunkirk.
But, over a six year war, the say… 100, at most, Waffen-SS soldiers who massacred the BEF at Dunkirk doesn’t mean the thousands of other SS over the time span of the war
were idiots with diseased minds, and that disease was the Nazi cults ethos and beliefs
And because of Hollywood, and people spreading the idea that the entire SS were ‘Goose Stepping Goones dressed in black and murdering every ‘unwanted’ individual they see’ makes me go crazy.
My great uncle was in the W-SS in the Eastern Front and faught to the death untill he was wounded. Never, ever (And he still lives by this) did he ever see any of his comrades or himself commit acts of genocide or war crimes.
Hope you get the picture
Oh, this brings up an argument. I’d have to disagree with you.
Most young men joined the Waffen-SS as a fighting force because they were more well equipped than the Wehrmacht, and they offered better pay. Most of the SS were doing soldier jobs, and yes, they were elite. Everyone country commits a war crime. And yes, I do look down on the Waffen-Schutzstaffel for actions at Dunkirk.
But, over a six year war, the say… 100, at most, Waffen-SS soldiers who massacred the BEF at Dunkirk doesn’t mean the thousands of other SS over the time span of the war
were idiots with diseased minds, and that disease was the Nazi cults ethos and beliefs
And because of Hollywood, and people spreading the idea that the entire SS were ‘Goose Stepping Goones dressed in black and murdering every ‘unwanted’ individual they see’ makes me go crazy.
My great uncle was in the W-SS in the Eastern Front and faught to the death untill he was wounded. Never, ever (And he still lives by this) did he ever see any of his comrades or himself commit acts of genocide or war crimes.
Hope you get the picture
Oh, this brings up an argument. I’d have to disagree with you.
Most young men joined the Waffen-SS as a fighting force because they were more well equipped than the Wehrmacht, and they offered better pay. Most of the SS were doing soldier jobs, and yes, they were elite. Everyone country commits a war crime. And yes, I do look down on the Waffen-Schutzstaffel for actions at Dunkirk.
But, over a six year war, the say… 100, at most, Waffen-SS soldiers who massacred the BEF at Dunkirk doesn’t mean the thousands of other SS over the time span of the war
were idiots with diseased minds, and that disease was the Nazi cults ethos and beliefs
And because of Hollywood, and people spreading the idea that the entire SS were ‘Goose Stepping Goones dressed in black and murdering every ‘unwanted’ individual they see’ makes me go crazy.
My great uncle was in the W-SS in the Eastern Front and faught to the death untill he was wounded. Never, ever (And he still lives by this) did he ever see any of his comrades or himself commit acts of genocide or war crimes.
Hope you get the picture
The Waffen-SS was one of the most feared force of WW2.They wore black trench coats,standerd military uniform,or something that makes them blend in with their surroundings.
The Waffen-SS was one of the most feared force of WW2.They wore black trenchcoats,black helmets with the SS insignia on it,standerd military uniforms or something to blend them in with their surrounding.They were also in charge of the death camps.
Most youg Germans today know little of the war let alone have any knowledge of the SS or the role the SS played i hitler’s war. The German education system as Australia’s education system only covers the very basics of WWII. Heck there are kids doing history courses who do not know of Adolf Hitler!
SS soldiers returning to Germany on leave, generally had a two week period of ‘fattening’ up behind the lines before commencig their home leave. during this period they would udertake light duties which could include security and patrol work or the garrisoning of ‘select areas’, including concentration camps. Not many members of the SS were totally ignorant of the excesses of Hitler’s Germany as quoted from a former SS soldier I once knew.
Regards digger
I would not sign that completely. For sure the pupils learn less about WW2, but much about the time before it.
Here in Germany the pupils learn muuuccchhh about the Weimarer Republik and the beginning of the National Socialistic Mouvement - i had History as main subject for four semesters and around one semester we made the Weimarer Republik, one semester the time from 1934 until 1945 mixed up with masses of blaming on Germany for the persucation of the Jews (was probably the main aspect in this semester - WW2 was not as important in history for our teacher). Most ridicolous was, that the Reichskristallnacht was more important for him than the Röhm Putsch and the taking over of the full control of the SS as the armed political arm of the NSDAP.
Compared to the time we made the Imperial Time (Industrialisation) and the Cold War era together with the nowadays history, which were only two semesters for a huge timeline is just ridicolous!
im starting 2 think that the whole german army
back in ww2 was full of forieners