2nd of foot wrote:
The border between the free state and the north was marked on maps, it was not often marked on the ground. Many farmers had fields on both side of the border and saw little point in recognising it (and still do for that matter).
The Murphy estate come to mind by any chance?
The border runs right throught Thomas Slabs barn 
1000 not a the time of writting, but know what you mean. Never met the guy only saw his place from the air or on photos. Spent 2 years on the border in Fermanagh and identifying the border was very difficult. I did know a number of the local farmers? 
who had farms and barns on both sides. The border area during the war had it a lot better than the rest of the country as they could travel across to get things that were unavailable in the north.
There is many anecdotal evidence of the guard helping servicemen get back to the UK from Erie.
Armagh myself. But yep, no formall boundaries they don’t even use streams or hills just a straight line!!! Possibly across the stream they could use, and straight through farms!!!
One farmer would sell his sheep depending on prices, he just put them in one field or another.
ALso heard the one about the underground fuel line. Although don’t know if it is true.
Read a book which included the anecdote of a Para patrol inserted by heli. They started sending reports back of massed Irish Army troops coming over the boarder. Then realised they were about 5 miles in to EIRE, and the troops were coming to see why the heli had landed!!!
The ZERO was hardly inferior…
Nick the other thing was that navigating over vast stretches of desolate ocean was a lot more dangerous than Europe in many ways too. If you went down out there it was a slim probability of being picked up. Over Europe if you went down you more likely lived even if you were a prisoner.
Nick Firefly was saying the inferior bit in jest. see smiley.
Never mind 1000Yd! Everyone back to the Irish once again please. We can discuss how inferior the Zero was in the Japanese section :twisted:
Sorry, I have brush up on my irony skills…
I’ve read that some IRA-men worked with German intelligence, and received small amounts of aid. Unfortunately, I stored my “The IRA” by noted Irish author Tim Pat Coogan away…
Since I used to live in the Republic of Ireland for several years (in Shannon, Co. Clare), this is a topic I’m quite interested in.
It was published by the Irish Times back in 1999 that during WW2 there were close ties between Eamon de Valera and Churchill, even though officially Eire was neutral.
Actually, in 1940, when there was the acute threat of a German invasion of Britain, Churchill offered de Valera Northern Ireland in return for the permission to use Irish sea ports for the Royal Navy. De Valera sensed that with this he would get a hornet’s nest, since the Ulster protestants would have never agreed to it.
On the other hand there were several secret agreements about British assistance, should Germany invade Ireland. The Irish Army was supplied with new British weapons and equipment (e.g. replacing the German “coal scuttle” WW1 helmets used by the Irish forces with British style Mk2 “tin hats”, so that in case of a British involvement in Ireland British soldiers would not mistake Irish soldiers for Germans). The Irish Air Corps was also supplied with Hurricane fighters and later Spitfires.
Shannon Airport and the flying boat harbour at Foynes on the southern bank of the river Shannon, west of Limerick, were extensively used by Allied troops to refuel before crossing the Atlantic ocean. Especially the American MATS (Military Air Transport service) used Shannon for it’s C-54s. In Shannon and Foynes Allied troops could walk around wearing uniform (though no arms).
At Shannon airport, today just behind the Shannon Aerospace hangars, are several artillery emplacements and bunkers built into a hill side. Before the hangar was built in the 1980s, they covered the whole airfield.
Obviously there were also people in Ireland, who hated the British and supported the Germans, especially members of the IRA. But since de Valera broke away from the IRA in the 1920s, he fought them left, right and center. The father of a good friend was arrested when the war (or “Emergency” as the Irish called it officially) began and, like many other IRA supporters, who considered de Valera’s government to be traitors, because they signed the free state agreement, under which the six mainly protestant counties of Ulster should stay British, interned for the duration, because the irish government was afraid that he and his frieds might help Germans (it actually happened that IRA groups supplied German U-boats in remote bays in north-west Ireland).
De Valera was walking a tightrope. On one hand he and many other Irish supported the Allied cause, but he couldn’t do it too publically, because there was the danger of rekindling the Irish Civil War of the early 1920s, and British attrocities, like the deployment of the Black and Tans were still remembered well by some people.
The Irish police were quite efficient though in arresting German spies.
Jan
Hi the new guy here,
I found this thread very interesting. As I said in the first email, my connection with WW’s is through grand uncles and great grand father, who were irish and catholic. because there are a few myths in Ireland about the people who joined and why on both sides (not important as most of it is crap)
I live in Donegal, NW ireland and the flying boats as they where known here, crossed Irish territory on there way back from the bay of Biscay over counties Leitrim, Sligo and SW Donegal flying towards Northern Ireland.
In fact a Sunderland crashed into the in the Blue Stack mountains near where I live. It was a Mk III, DW-110 from squadron 228 from Pembroke Dock, Wales.
It was diverted to Castle Archdale after patrol due to adverse weather in Wales. The plane was seen over the town of Glenties on its return on 31-jan 1943, it hit the mountain apprx 3metres from the top.
Seven of the twelve crew where killed. There is a memorial to them at the site on the mountain, as the engines and some debris of the plane. Most of the wreckage was taken by tinkers or Itinerants. Quite a few Allied planes crashed in Donegal during the war. Will post the list later.
There was a US airbase in Eglington outside Derry, there was one at Castle Archdale, (theres a flying boats museum there) in County Fermangh and of course as was mentioned there was one at Lough Erne. I am not an expert on the airforces, but I can get the info easily enough.
An old aunt of mine used to tell us, how when they were children in Inishowen, (most northerly point Ireland) they used to watch the sky in the distance light up as the convoys were being attacked and the debris used to wash up frequently as well as (unfortunately) human remains. Lots of Irish served in the Navy and mercant marine probably more than in the armies.
The problem with ireland is that people, in WWII remembered the deaths of WWI, 1916, the vagaries of the Auxilairies and the Balck and tans. Britains rather vigorous policy to quell the natives. We dont have this perspective anymore and its hard to judge.
I think the real testament of Irelands allegiance is in the fact that there was no ‘SS Hibernia’ 
My grand uncle was in the irish army and found it mind numbing, was bought out. 3 months later he got fed of farming and buggered off and joined the British in Dunree (a treaty port till '38), he was in the 1st Middlesex regiment in Hong Kong and is listed on the Sei Wan Memorial 19. But he used to write and my grandmother remembered his last christmas card Xmas 41.
Anyway dont want to go on too much, its good to see people are talking about this at least…
Seán