What if the Germans won 'the Battle of Bulge'?

well, if those tanks are to put at defense, then its a matter of time that hitler would be defeated

i guess to get out and try one more time is worth it
if i am him, i would have done the same thing and see what happen

SS Tiger- Good point- interesting to think that WW 2 was the 1st conflict where air power played a deciding factor in the outcome, isn’t it? In every conflict since air domination has been the 1st rule of battle.

By the time of the Ardennes battle the Germans had long past the point where they could have ever again gained Air Superiority. Hosenfeld gave figures once on the amount of aircraft that the Germans could sustain in battle if all went well, it was not very much.

By the time of the Ardennes battle the Germans had long past the point where they could have ever again gained Air Superiority. Hosenfeld gave figures once on the amount of aircraft that the Germans could sustain in battle if all went well, it was not very much.[/quote]

Overlooked, the Luftwaffe lauched numerous airstrikes on RAF and USAAF airfields at the out set of the battle, destroying something like 400 allied aircraft, they then lost roughly the same number so it was clearly a much greater loss for the Luftwaffe. This is from memory, so I may be a little off…

By the time of the Ardennes battle the Germans had long past the point where they could have ever again gained Air Superiority. Hosenfeld gave figures once on the amount of aircraft that the Germans could sustain in battle if all went well, it was not very much.[/quote]

Overlooked, the Luftwaffe lauched numerous airstrikes on RAF and USAAF airfields at the out set of the battle, destroying something like 400 allied aircraft, they then lost roughly the same number so it was clearly a much greater loss for the Luftwaffe. This is from memory, so I may be a little off…[/quote]

You may be thinking of “Operation Budentplatte”…

Germany lost the war by its own stupidness!!!
Hitler was the Leader of all german Attack and Defense- Plans…
The Generals just had to sign it.
I guess “Blitzkrieg” was Hitlers idea…
but there is just one example neccessary to explain why he doesnt rule the world today (noone is more satisfied whith that fact than me)!

ME 262:
The fastest Fighterplane on earth in that time:
-He messed the ressources on projects like “DORA”
-He wanted to arm the ME262 with BOMBS (A Fighter with bombs is like a Dodge Viper with a Winnebago Trailer to pull)
-He was INSANE enough to believe to battle against the allies and russia at the same time would be a good idea…

That situation is very dangerous, and there are some more of those insane characters in this world today.

Wrong guess. Heinz Guderian tells you something?

[quote=“Dani”]

Wrong guess. Heinz Guderian tells you something?[/quote]
The essentials for motorised Blitzkrieg were there in “Plan 1919” by J.F.C. Fuller, adopted by the Allies around summer 1918. Fortunately the war ended before they tried to use it, because although it was very modern in conception it would most probably have broken down for reasons of logistics.

Edited to add that if you substitute horses for internal combustion engines, Genghis Khan and his successors seem to have had a very good understanding of the subject.

Wrong guess. Heinz Guderian tells you something?[/quote]
The essentials for motorised Blitzkrieg were there in “Plan 1919” by J.F.C. Fuller, adopted by the Allies around summer 1918. Fortunately the war ended before they tried to use it, because although it was very modern in conception it would most probably have broken down for reasons of logistics.[/quote]

Also I made a wrong guess :oops:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J.F.C._Fuller

Thanks pdf27 for pointing it out! :wink:

Edited:

British theorists J.F.C. Fuller and B. H. Liddell Hart have often been associated with blitzkrieg’s development, though this is a matter of controversy. It is argued that Guderian, a critical figure in blitzkrieg’s conception, drew some of his inspiration from Hart. This was based on a paragraph in the English edition of Guderian’s autobiography in which he credits Hart. In opposition, it is argued that Hart, as editor of the autobiography’s English edition, wrote that paragraph himself or, more broadly, that his influence on Guderian was not as significant as held. Fuller’s influence is less clear. During the war, he developed plans for massive, independent tank operations and was subsequently studied by the German leadership. It is variously argued that Fuller’s wartime plans and post-war writings were an inspiration, or that his readership was low and German experiences during the war received more attention.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitzkrieg

Wrong guess. Heinz Guderian tells you something?[/quote]
The essentials for motorised Blitzkrieg were there in “Plan 1919” by J.F.C. Fuller, adopted by the Allies around summer 1918. Fortunately the war ended before they tried to use it, because although it was very modern in conception it would most probably have broken down for reasons of logistics.

Edited to add that if you substitute horses for internal combustion engines, Genghis Khan and his successors seem to have had a very good understanding of the subject.[/quote]

Very true about Ghengis, read ‘Reconaissance in Force’ all about the Mongol sortie into Europe!

I thought what became the “Blitzkrieg,” a British coined term BTW, was a thought experiment conducted in the 1920’s by a British general, based on “Plan 1919,” and the increased reliability of the tank and of automotive tech. in general…

But the “Blitz,” upon my understanding, was a long process of evolution, people forget that the post WW1 German paramilitary militias often used armored cars and prized rapid mobility, as did the regular Army, since they were governed at only 100,000 men as per Versailles…

I think the Germans also conducted armored maneuvers, ironically, with the Red Army on the Russian planes in the 20’s and early 30’s since it was forbidden in Germany to do so, or to develop real tanks…

anyways, german soldiers would dress as american soldiers, trying to confuse the allies

the american respond with asking every soldier in checkpoint about US baseball, celebrities. One German soldier was shot because he refered US as colleagues instead of troops, and one innocent american three star general is under arrested because he said chicago white sox is in the AL instead of NL (forget if its the other way around)

eventually, those german who dressed as american soldiers are executed.