Beware Historical Revisionists

[Cuts]

@Blitz

What I meant by pathetic, was that Churchill admitted to roosevelt Stalin should have been the one who got ko’d. Which he well knew before han

And,NO, they didn’t pay it back. First I’ve heard about 2006. The heck with the cash. I would rather have back the American lives lost for naught.

The bankers and munitions makers etc. are the ones who proft. Going to war was the end for England.

Hmmm…
You are an interesting chap aren’t you ?

It’s unusual to have an American - if indeed you are one - talking about the English when they mean the British, it’s usually the other way round.
I have heard many other geographical confusions, but not that one.
Well, only from one person…

I can’t really comment on the first part of your post as you haven’t finished it, but from what you have written so far I gather that you think Churchill was pathetic for telling Roosevelt that Stalin was to be a great enemy. Would you rather he had kept quiet about this ?
I look forward to reading your post in full.

Would you care to inform us where you have gained your impression that monies from the Lend-Lease agreement have not been repaid ?

Yes, there were war profiteers, but you’re being myopic if you think this was limited to bankers and armaments manufacturers, not all of these that made any money at all from the war.

Finally, your comment of retrieval of “American lives lost for naught” is in extremely bad taste.
Putting aside the fact that many lives of good men and women from nations other than the US were lost, the very notion that it was for naught is abhorrent.
Would you rather have nations under the jackboot of Nazism ?
Do you think it’s permissible for people of a certain religon to be murdered for no other reason than the way they worship their God ?
If that’s ok then perhaps you also think that people with a different coloured skin from your own are fair game too.
Or old people. Or the disabled.

Hundreds of thousands of fighting men died, but to claim that it was for nothing shows an utter lack of respect to their memory.

[Firefly]

Is it strange that the Western Democracies genuinely fought for a cause, maybe the last time we ever did so. To describe their sacrifice as meaningless and for nothing is to denigrate all the man and women that gave their lives in that struggle.

What would the World be like today if the Democracies had sat back and washed their hands of it all, would there even be any Democracies?

[2nd_of_foot]

@Bladensburg

I believe the loans should be paid back in late 2006.

Of course the US has made much more money out of the companies and capital that Britain surrendered to the US to fund the war than they ever did out of the loans. Most of the post-war economic boom in the States was as a direct result of the things they got at rock bottom prices during the war.

The US also got the Dollar accepted as the international trading standard in the post war negotiations. Prior to the war all international trade was in sterling. The US also wanted the break up of the empire trading agreement, which let any country in the empire trade at favourable rates within the empire. External countries paid heavy duties to sell goods within the empire, and as the empire was most of the world, this had a direct effect on the US trade.

[festamus]

And got the bases to project their power around the world for the next 60 years.

[system]

Again," Stuck the wrong pig" Pretty much speaks for itself.I do not understand what is so hard to comprehend. Pathetic.

Where in the world did you ever get the idea the war dept was paid back???

And for naught. roosevelt was a traitor. The U.S.A. was not in any danger from Hitler. GB was bailed out. It is of my opinion, The U.S. should have remained neutral. Outside of the American Revolution and the War of 1812,(sound familiar?) all the rest were a waist of good young men.The cream of the crop.Nothing gained for people. And that goes for all Nations. Let the ‘elected’ ones and their families do their bidding$$ WW1,2,Korea, Nam and since., profiteering. I don’t mean to put the 'English,British down.Not trying to. One would be a fool not to defend their Nationalism. And a bigger one to let it go.

[Firefly]

19 Posts in and you could actually call yourself Iron-Blitz, what a shockingly miopic view of history.

I advise you to go read some books and come back.

Roosevelt was the President that pulled the US out of the depression, sure he had his faults but he was in the end a great man. He had the foresight which your hindsight lacks Im afraid.

His and the US’s stand against the forces of evil is commendable. If Hitler and his cronies were allowed to ravage the whole of Europe without reply and support then the conseqences would not bear thinking about. Lend lease to the Soviets significantly helped win the war. Just imagine a Nazi Germany free from a second or 3rd front, free to concentrate on an unsupported USSR. Lesser of two evils in my opinion.

[pdf27]

@Blitz

Where in the world did you ever get the idea the war dept was paid back???

@Hansard

“Bob Spink: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) what outstanding liabilities there are to the United Kingdom of lend-lease loan facilities arranged during the Second World War; [38441]…”

“Ruth Kelly: The information is as follows.”…

"Under the Agreement the loans would be repaid in 50 annual instalments [sic] commencing in 1950. However the Agreement allowed deferral of annual payments of both principal and interest if necessary because of prevailing international exchange rate conditions and the level of the United Kingdom’s foreign currency and gold reserves. The United Kingdom has deferred payments on six occasions. Repayment of the war loans to the United States Government should therefore be completed on 31 December 2006, subject to the United Kingdom not choosing to exercise its option to defer payment.

As at 31 March 2001 principal of $346,287,953 (£243,573,154 at the exchange rate on that day) was outstanding on the loans provided by the United States Government in 1945. The Government intend to meet its obligations under the 1945 Agreement by repaying the United States Government in full the amounts lend [sic] in 1945. "

@Hansard

"Lord Campbell of Croy: My Lords, is this payment part of the lend-lease scheme under which the United States supplied munitions, vehicles and many other requirements including food and other provisions that were needed badly by us in the last part of the war?

Lord McIntosh of Haringey: My Lords, I referred to lend-lease in the context of the generosity of the United States throughout that period. However, the debt that we are talking about now is separate; it was negotiated in December 1945.

Lord Stoddart of Swindon: My Lords, will the noble Lord remind me as to exactly how much the loan was, and how much we have repaid since then in principal and interest?

Lord McIntosh of Haringey: My Lords, the loan originally was £1,075 million, of which £244 million is outstanding. The basis of the loan is that interest is paid at 2 per cent. Therefore, we are currently receiving a greater return on our dollar assets than we are paying in interest to pay off the loan. It is a very advantageous loan for us. "

So in other words you’re either as ignorant as you are accusing everyone else of being, or you’re lying through your teeth. Have you been taking lessons from a certain ferrous individual?

[Sturmtruppen]

@Cuts

It’s unusual to have an American - if indeed you are one - talking about the English when they mean the British, it’s usually the other way round.
I have heard many other geographical confusions, but not that one.
Well, only from one person…

Ohhh!!!,Argentines aren’t alone!!!

[system]

Very biased and one sided indeed!(members of forum) A little over pompus also. As far as roosevelt “The Traitor” You sir are the one who should do a little more reading. For you do not know ‘jack’ about him other than what has been forced through so-called history’ books. Do some leg work. The info. is out there. A liar? How harsh. I never said you were ignorant. You do a good enough job of that yourself. It still is not paid off. Is it?

[Firefly]

Ok then Mr Blitz. What have I and countless millions of others got wrong about Mr Roosevelt?

Please enlighten us with the information that you obviously do know and we ‘untermensh’ from accross the sea do not?

I for one am willing to give you the benefit of the doubt.

[Man_of_Stoat]

Let’s look at the facts here. 1. Tone of posting. 2. Being confrontational. 3. Not reading what’s written. 4. Spelling. 5. Changing point mid-argument. 6. Ignoring facts from reputable sources. 7. “Pathetic.” 8. “Saved your ass” attitude. 9. Claiming that “there are sources out there” but never providing any.

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, it is my contention that our “friend” just can’t stay away.

Man of Stoat’s wife says:
Blitz or Ironman or whoever you are, if you actually are an American and genuinely believe that Americans who died in WW2 gave their lives for nothing, then I am ashamed that you are my countryman.

[pdf27]

@Man_of_Stoat

Let’s look at the facts here. 1. Tone of posting. 2. Being confrontational. 3. Not reading what’s written. 4. Spelling. 5. Changing point mid-argument. 6. Ignoring facts from reputable sources. 7. “Pathetic.” 8. “Saved your ass” attitude. 9. Claiming that “there are sources out there” but never providing any.

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, it is my contention that our “friend” just can’t stay away.

I propose a test. Blitz, what do you think of the M1 carbine?

[Sturmtruppen]

@Man_of_Stoat

Let’s look at the facts here…

stoaty,that was not nice (Im not nice but it is not the point) ,if you do not want to be insulted don’t insult! (that also goes to me,but i don’t worry for being or not insulted).

what do you think of the M1 carbine?

is it an assault rifle :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: ,mate,he cannot be frionpan,ironman don’t even knows how to change the ip,and he has be completely banned from here,so he will not be able to return.

[system]

As I stated, Try looking it up . A good place to start would be’None dare call it TREASON , by John A. Stormer. roosevelts administration was rife with ‘communists’. But then again,thats what Hitler was fighting. Oh,thats right, Stalin was one of the’allies’. A lot of hate goin on here. Nasty,nasty! I do beleive the “jury” is rigged.

The M-1 carbine is a nice little collectors item. A bit under powered. Nice and light and easy to weild. I like the M-1Garand personally. I have one in most excellent shape. I have a small range (50 yd.)on my property that I shoot it at along with the rest of my 2nd. amenment weapons.

Why do you want me kicked off here?

[Firefly]

You still havent answered the question though. I could order the book, wait 3 months for it to arrive and say, hey, Blitz was right. On the other hand you can explain why Roosevelt was a traitor?

Seems to me, if you already know, you could share the info with us. That is after all what this Forum is about. Isnt it?

[Bladensburg]

Well, the blaming “commies” for everything regardless of facts is a classic sign of a a certain sort of American so I think we can confirm his nationality They still do it now if you have a look at mil.com, even though none of the people they finger as communists are any such thing.

Blitz - you have failed to awknowledge your error with regards to the Lend-lease debts, although you heve been shown proof. Please do so or sod off.

[Firefly]

Of course many in the US think that is you are slightly left of ‘Burn them all in Hell’ evangelicals, ergo a communist you must be!

[2nd_of_foot]

@Blitz

As I stated, Try looking it up . A good place to start would be’None dare call it TREASON , by John A. Stormer. roosevelts administration was rife with ‘communists’. But then again,thats what Hitler was fighting. Oh,thats right, Stalin was one of the’allies’. A lot of hate goin on here. Nasty,nasty! I do beleive the “jury” is rigged.

Were they communists or just had socialist views? And what wrong with being communist? Christ was one.

Hitler was not fighting communists he wanted power. Not many communist is Poland, France, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, Czechoslovakia or Greece (my apologies for the ones I have mist some).

roosevelt was a traitor.

Please enlighten me, why was he a traitor. Did he fight against his own country?

The U.S.A. was not in any danger from Hitler.

I seem to remember something about Mr Brown having plans for an intercontinental missile. Germany was also allied to Japan who saw the US as a threat to their interest in the pacific.

The U.S. should have remained neutral. Outside of the American Revolution and the War of 1812,(sound familiar?) all the rest were a waist of good young men.

You forgot the Mexican wars and the Spanish wars and the Indian wars not to mention the greatest loss of life the 2nd civil war. And the war of 1812 was one that was a total waste of good men in a hunt to enrich others.

Nothing gained for people. And that goes for all Nations.

You got the Philippines for a short time.

And as it has already been pointed out the LL has been paid off. The agreement in the 50s saw the US get a very good deal and move into the world power market.

[Sturmtruppen]

@Blitz

Why do you want me kicked off here?

I don’t want you kicked off mate,i was just intervening as an impartial ,i sent you an email,check the inbox!,you understood bad mate,im sorry,i forget to say that i was making reference to an ex member called IRONMAN.

excuse me.

[system]

I guess this thread should be put to sleep. Y’ll beleive what ya want. As I stated early on,I don’t mean to offend anyone. You have no proof to the contrary about fdr. Outside of mainsteam history.They taught me the same crap when I was in school. The victors write ‘history’.Don’t be so afraid to expand your thoughts.
And I am a commie? A leftist?Wow. Any ole ways, I am just plain darn happy I live here. The time is, 11:45am It’s 71 degrees outside, The sun is shining brightly,clean air. Beautiful!! Y’ll gotta come in out of the fog.