Do you think the USSR would've defeated Germany w/o allies?

If germany fought the war with only one front-

With no lend-lease to the russians-

No allied bombers attacking german factories-

No air wars/u-boat fighting to drain german resources for the kreigmarine and luftwaffe.

I think the germans would’ve taken russia.

Well it depends Hosenfield…depends on if you mean could the Russians defeat Germany without any help after 1942 or 1944…which year mate?

from the start

That is quite a topic to debate on Hosenfield, quite something to think about.
I would say the Russians would most likely be defeated if it was just the Germans vs Soviet Union, even though their was tens of millions of Russians and the Germans had about half the troops the russians did,
but mind you there was 130 russian divisions when war broke out 1941 when there was 140 german divisions.
The Germans were much more prepared for War and well trained unlike the russian conscripts.

Well when the Germans did attack russia 0300 hours on June 22, 1941, they had alread been at war for 3 years and quite weakened.
They attacked the soviet union on that day with 140 German Divisions, they were split into three army groups…
1.to capture Leningrad
2.Kiev
3.Moscow

If the Russians and Germans had gone to war singularly with eachother then i reckon with the German factories, techonology and knowledge they would of beaten the Russians but only just with mighty losses from the
German side.

I think NO germans and all axis will then fight in Russia ,soviets then for sure lose. :wink:

Well it depends as i said before…if only germany is versing russia that , would germany be still having help from its axis allies or on it’s owne…e.g Italians,french…ect, because if it was JUST the germans against the russians then the germany army population would decrease heaps.

My history teacher told me that Russia could’ve defeated NAZI Germany without ANY allies. While I had my doubts, recently I read that Hitler used around 80% of his total military forces on the Eastern Front (Russia), the rest he kept in Western Europe. So if Russia had beaten Hitler’s 80% armed forces on her own, I doubt the other 20% would’ve helped ? Just my opinion, please correct me if I’m wrong ! :slight_smile:

True, but most likely that a large percentage of them soldiers were from Nazi occupied countries such as Italy, France, Poland…ect
Other Axis countries.
So if the Russians are not having any help from their allies then the Germans shouldn’t have any help from their Axis Bumchums, you know what i mean?

True Comrade Jordovski… So are you with me or against me ? :slight_smile: I didn’t quite get your point haha…

No offense, but many people on this site probably know more about ww2 then your high school history teacher. While its true that russia consumed around 4/5s of germany’s land forces, it was much less taxing on the german airforce and kreigsmarine. Russia lacked the ability to successfully combat the german navy and airforce in the first three and half years of the war.

And it took about three years for the western allies to pound at the german airforce and navy until the west was vulnerable to an invasion and german’s factories were being bombed.

the naval battles in teh western front forced germany to produce around 940 U-boats, which consumed a lot of germany’s industrial strength. not to mention thousands of aircraft. the resources that this war material consumed could’ve been sent to the eastern front in the form of tanks and more aircraft, more motorization.

In 1942, germany was dangerously close at overcoming the soviet union. they completely had the change. and they blew it by wasting 300,000 men in pointless close combat at stalingrad and loseing a lot of equipment.
but even if this stuipid attack was taken out, imagine if germany’s afrika korp under rommel was here? I’m sure that operation uranus would’ve failed. the germans had already taken more then 3/4s of the city by then.

After a proposed victory at stalingrad, the route to the caucauses would be open, and russia’s fuel wells would be taken. about 85% of russia’s fuel was supplied from this region, so if taken and succeffully defended, russia would “bleed to death”.

furhtermore, historically speaking, by 1945, russia was at the end of their manpower pool 12 million russian soldiers had died along with 17 million civilians. They started suffering the same manpower shortages the germans were suffering in early 1944/late 1943.

Siberian, your picture seems to be fiction. the russian aT rifle never had a magazine. and that guy seems to be wearing a flak vest.?

Oh come on Hosenfield buddy :wink: , the guys new lets give him a break :wink: :wink: :smiley:

You got a cool illustrated avatar mate, rather fictitious character, The weapon he is holding looks more like a RPD degtarev. 8) 8)

hmm, just curious on where he got that picture.

Probably googled for it, theres heaps of pictures like that on google or other related image search engines.

There were 2 russian anti-tank rifles - one a bolt-action (PTRD) and one a semi-auto (PTRS with a 5-shot magazine).

A good article on Russian anti-tank rifles: http://www.smallarmsreview.com/pdf/antitank.pdf

thats right. hmm, the father of the barrett i presume?

Hello there Hosenfield, that is a PTRS the guy is holding, not a PTRD :slight_smile:

I think you’re right on the flak vest though :slight_smile:

No offense, but many people on this site probably know more about ww2 then your high school history teacher. While its true that russia consumed around 4/5s of germany’s land forces, it was much less taxing on the german airforce and kreigsmarine. Russia lacked the ability to successfully combat the german navy and airforce in the first three and half years of the war.

And it took about three years for the western allies to pound at the german airforce and navy until the west was vulnerable to an invasion and german’s factories were being bombed.

the naval battles in teh western front forced germany to produce around 940 U-boats, which consumed a lot of germany’s industrial strength. not to mention thousands of aircraft. the resources that this war material consumed could’ve been sent to the eastern front in the form of tanks and more aircraft, more motorization.

In 1942, germany was dangerously close at overcoming the soviet union. they completely had the change. and they blew it by wasting 300,000 men in pointless close combat at stalingrad and loseing a lot of equipment.
but even if this stuipid attack was taken out, imagine if germany’s afrika korp under rommel was here? I’m sure that operation uranus would’ve failed. the germans had already taken more then 3/4s of the city by then.

After a proposed victory at stalingrad, the route to the caucauses would be open, and russia’s fuel wells would be taken. about 85% of russia’s fuel was supplied from this region, so if taken and succeffully defended, russia would “bleed to death”.

furhtermore, historically speaking, by 1945, russia was at the end of their manpower pool 12 million russian soldiers had died along with 17 million civilians. They started suffering the same manpower shortages the germans were suffering in early 1944/late 1943.[/quote]

Thank you Hosenfield, this is the kind of reply I’m hoping for :slight_smile: Really educational, thank you very much !

that guy seems to be carrying an ammo box (about 15 pounds), the ptrs(45 pounds) a flak vest (30 pounds) something on his back( about 10-20 pounds). how the heck does he walk? lol.