What were the repurcussions of losing the Falklands war, and so many young conscripts lives?
The Junta lasted just over a year, but what were the ramifications in Argentina.
THe mothers called for all sorts of action I believe, but did it have an affect? Did the Dirty war increase in order to take on these troublemakers?
I know of the aftermath in UK but little of the results in Argentina when their troops were returned on the QE2 and Canberra.
Any knowledge out there?
The fact president, Galtieri was immediately removed from his charge, and their succesor General Bignone based his presidence to prepare the armed forces and the people to return the power to a democratic government, which was reached at the last months of 1983.
Then, the three leaders (Galtieri from the Army, Anaya from the Navy and Lami Dozo from the Air Force) were judged and found guilty. They had to serve 14 (Anaya), 12 (Galtieri) and 8 (Lami Dozo) years of prison.
According to the armed forces, the obligatory military service was removed in the middle of the 90’s, so the number of men in them are only 75.000, all volunteers. The forces, specially the Air Force, had to suffer a huge reduction of funds, so were reduced too (talking about reductions of the number of vehicles and guns)
According to the Square May’s Mothers (Madres de Plaza de Mayo) were not mothers of argentine soldiers died in the war, they are mothers who lost their sons or daughters in the large period of disappearances managed by the Army, between 1976 and 1980 aproximately.
Sorry about my time out of the forum… but I am back!
Were there no protests at all by the mothers of the lost conscripts?
What happened when the ships docked and disembarked their passengers back to the Argentine mainland? Were families kept away or were they able to get to the quayside?
According to the armed forces, the obligatory military service was removed in the middle of the 90’s, so the number of men in them are only 75.000, all volunteers.
Wich had NOTHING to do with Malvinas, the president Menem removed in 1994 the obligatory service because a soldier was murdered for a superior officer between others matters.
The forces, specially the Air Force, had to suffer a huge reduction of funds, so were reduced too (talking about reductions of the number of vehicles and guns
In the immediate period yes.
According to the Square May’s Mothers (Madres de Plaza de Mayo) were not mothers of argentine soldiers died in the war, they are mothers who lost their sons or daughters in the large period of disappearances managed by the Army, between 1976 and 1980 aproximately.
Some of those were terrorist mothers, like Bonafini. :roll:
Panzerknacker wrote:
president Menem removed in 1994 the obligatory service because a soldier was murdered for a superior officer between others matters.
Spill the beans, old boy. Do tell. 
What happened?
Not much more than I said before, a soldier was murderer in his Quarter for an superior officer with the help of some soldiers, kind of that Tom Cruise movie “code of Honor”…that and the historical dislike of the nonsupport argentine society wich had no a particular good feelings about the military after the 7 years between 1976-83 caused this presidential decree…a right thing to do in my opinion, there is plenty volunteers.
[quote]According to the Square May’s Mothers (Madres de Plaza de Mayo) were not mothers of argentine soldiers died in the war, they are mothers who lost their sons or daughters in the large period of disappearances managed by the Army, between 1976 and 1980 aproximately.
Some of those were terrorist mothers, like Bonafini. :roll:[/quote]
Yeah, I agree with you that some were terrorists, but some were innocent, or enthusiastic boys who only painted walls and that kind of things.
That was my point… some are some dont, not all of them was saints with a halo over their heads like some media want to make us believe.
I’m more interested in the human cost of the conflict such as PTSD and related issues. I’ve seen some grim stat’s regarding UK veterans that quote a suicide rate that has surpassed the combat fatality figure and is similar to the US experience for Vietnam veterans.
I have to admit that I have a bit of a selfish reason in this as I’m intending to go for my Phd next year ( when I may change my surname to Who) and am looking towards doing a comparitive study between the psychological effects of combat experience between mainly conscript (fixed term) combatants against professional ( indeterminate tenure) soldiers as my core reseach study.
I suspect that prior experience particularly Northern Ireland has’nt been factored in to previous studies. I’m only interested in NCO’s down (as holding a commission is usually a licence to print your own money) as I suspect that the ability to access support is related to education, income and social issues.
I have started the ground work with a couple of FI veterans who I hung out with while growing up( one 3 Para, head wound and medical discharge and a Bootie who served a further five years) the level of support that each recieved has been radically different though both faced similar emotional problems following the War, with the wounded friend reciving a higher level of support, possibly due to his visible scars.
I was at the wedding of my mate from 3 Para in 83 his best man was Denzil Corrick, after hearing him claim to be the first person to be legless at the wedding I stated my admiration for him considering his condition his reply has stayed with me since " I lost my legs not my sense of houmor" now thats ball’s for you.
Both my initial study group are top blokes but one has thrived, strong family man witha small business( founded with Falklands fund money) while the other has at best marked time, low income ( uniformed security) jobs and is always getting into pub kick off’s and unable to maintain relationships though both shared a similar social and family background.
I am currently setting up my control group who have either experienced PTSD or cracked on regardless with NI experience only and will be hunting down my study groups over the comming months, so if any of you have any contacts please feel free to PM me with their details especially English speaking Argntine vets as my Spanish is limited to ordring beer only.
I will need to access quite a number of subjects to legitimise my work which is why I am starting now, my course is eighteen months off but with these things preperation is everything.
Having spent a period in the hell that is PTSD I am aware that the trigger to PTSD may occur long after the significant incident, In my case being caught in an armed robbery in the early 90’s triggered unresolved issues from an incident in Ballymurphy in 79 involving two close friends( Chris and Ste) but being a student with access to adequate suportive services I was able to develope stratagies to begin to live with my problems and I stress live with my PTSD as I firmly believe that you don’t get over PTSD you learn to live with it but don’t allow it to define who you are.
Sorry if I am wafflng, 2nd of foot’s last post on the mines thead kicked me off into nostalgia and left me hunting through my dad’s loft for my old photos and bits of lost ? kit , all I found was a bunch of mildewed negatives and some mess tins issued in 78 but stamped WD( War Department)and a red and white kafir. The night sky over Brecon was like black velvet strewn with diamonds, you could see all the stars and to a city boy like me it was incredible, now where is my next bottle of stella.
Oop’s alcohol and enthusiasm got the better of me there non the less I will keep you all posted as my research developes.
I once read an article/editorial about a couple of US Army psychologists in the 1950s that performed an extensive study of combat effectiveness of US troops during WWII through interviews of veterans conducted in VA hospitals. It stunned them to find that very few US troops actually tried to kill the enemy in combat, aiming instead to cover themselves and to keep the enemy at bay. Many reported that they “froze” when they had that opportunity to kill a German in their sights, and the a relative few soldiers did the majority of the killing in fire fights…
Their findings were applied to basic combat training throughout NATO, and the aim of that training was to desensitize soldiers towards killing other people. The results of which can be seen in the US post-Vietnam experience of post traumatic stress disorder. It was fascinating…
What were the post-vietnam effects?
Is that the suicide rates and feeling of being ostracised?
I think the effects were much higher than in previous wars due to a variety of reasons. The social upheval caused by the War didn’t help. But I think I wrote in another thread that Vietnam accelerated the drug problem in America, by introducing heroin on a much wider scale to the US population.
Agent Orange, and the increased cancer rates among US vets, and the Vietnamese in rural areas, has been a problem…
The nature of the War itself was also vastly different. I can’t remember the numbers, but a combat infantryman in Vietnam could expect far more days in combat than a equivalent WWII US soldier, and he was several years younger on average (19). It’s been postulated that men that are still teens are far more susceptible to suffering psyche problems later in life due to combat stresses, because their brains are not fully developed yet. And the schizophrenic nature of the fighting, as in one minute, you were in combat, the next, you were on a chopper going back to a relatively safe rear area where you could drink Budweiser or Coke, and eat steak, may have had a lot to do with it. I’m reminded of a line from “Apocalypse Now,” “The more they tried to make it like home, the more everybody missed it.”
Although I find the PTSD discussion very interesting, can I steer you back into the S Atlantic and away from SE Asia?
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Did you actually change anything in my post Nickdfresh? :?
No. I added, then I taketh away… :lol: Sorry I hit the wrong button…