Hi has anyone got any information about the Mohne Dams and the dambusters raids?
I heard the weapon was designed by the USAF but their aircraft didnt have bomb bays suitable for the job and had to hand control to the RAF.
Can anyone fill me in on this?
As far as I can find out having a quick look round tinternet, it was designed by a Brit called Barnes Wallis.
See link for more details: Dam Busters
Intersting: 
“Bouncing Bomb” made by some British Scientist was supposed to spin at a very high rate, bounce over the torpedo nets and use the water to their advantage for maximum explosiveness while blasting into the dams.
More information at Wiki (I demand u to read it!) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bouncing_bomb
Also, to anyone who has played Call of Duty the first game, I seem to remember, that when you were playing the British, you became some kind of Special forces, and your goal was to plant explosives on the Flak 88s so that the RAF and take the dams out, I suppose there is some relation??
Here is a pic of a bouncing bomb on a Lancaster bomber. Although i have heard some versions were round.
I played a pretty cool game call Secret weopans over Normandy…i think…anyhow you could use the boucing bomb to take out bridges and such. Pretty decent game.
I have been to the mohne dam whilst visiting the british army sailing club which is on the mohne itself, you can see the damage caused by the bouncing bomb, the new brickwork been very obvious. at the base of the dam there is a replica of the bomb used.
as a point of historic curiosity, a boncing bomb was recovered off a lancaster that was shot down, German Scientists reverse engineered it and made their own versions which were rocket assisted! allthough these were only prototypes and never used in anger.
I was in Germany just down the road from the Dame and we would often be taken out and dropped off so we could walk back.
One of the prototypes. This could be your round one.
http://www.dorsetriviera.com/onlocation/jurassic.asp
This has film of one being tested.
http://www.thedambusters.org.uk/upkeep.html
It was also scaled down for the mosquito to use against ships. Particularly ones stuck in Norway.
http://www.ww2guide.com/bombs.shtml
Highball ‘Bouncing Bomb’
This spherical bomb was designed by the brilliant Dr. Barnes Wallis to be utilized against ships. Weighing 1,280 lb (580kg) and packed with 600 lb (272 kg) of explosive two Highballs could be carried by a Mosquito fighter-bomber. Prior to release the bomb was imparted with a backward spin of 700-900 revolutions per minute. Dropped at high speed 360 mph (580km/h) and low altitude 60 ft (18.2m) the Highball would skip across the water toward the target.
Although intended to be used against the battleship Tirpitz this did not come to pass mainly because the ship stayed in ports beyond the range of Mosquitos based in Britain. Focus shifted to possible use in the Far East and a number of Mosquitos were modified for use on escort/jeep carriers. Despite considerable training the weapon was not used in combat.
They developed a few prototypes but then gave up in 1944.
As far as I’m aware, there was no special forces mission to take out AAA round the dams before the raid, there was a lot of AA fire during the raid and 6 or 7 of the bombers involved were shot down.
Just reminded of a classic line from the film “The Dambusters”, where Wallis is trying to persuade a desk type to arrange for him to have a Wellington bomber to work with to develop the bomb:
Desk Type:“What possible reason could I put forward to the Air Ministry to get you a Wellington?”
Barnes Wallis:“You could mention that I designed it, would that help?”
Bouncing bombs eh?
617 Sqn Royal Air Force was created for the purpose of destroying the dams with the bouncing bomb.
The Sqn Commander was Wing Commander Guy Gibson and they trained in Scotland for their mission.
The bomb was designed by barnes Wallace, the designer of the Geodetic Wellington Bomber.
The dams were breached at great cost to the attacking force as stated in the above posts.
Th idea was definately not American, as so many ideas today seem to have been re-invented for the american public to somehow make them feel superior.
The Lancaster aircraft were specially modified to take them and 617 Sqn went on to be a special operations squadron in the RAF, utilizing the biggest bombs of any aircraft in WW2. The 22000 punder being just one of them. They also sunk the Tirpitz with these big bombs.
617 sqn still exist today and fly the Tornado.
Also, to anyone who has played Call of Duty the first game, I seem to remember, that when you were playing the British, you became some kind of Special forces, and your goal was to plant explosives on the Flak 88s so that the RAF and take the dams out, I suppose there is some relation??
I would advise taking the Call of Duty videogame with a large pinch of salt! It is a fun shoot-em-up, but bears as much resemblance to warfare or to history as do the old 8-bit games of the 1980s.
I suspect that anti-aircraft fire was seen as an occupational hazard…53 of 133 aircrew were killed - 40%. My own jaundiced view is that the raid was only of significant propaganda view and that Harris should have been sacked because of his insubordination and refusal to reconsider redeploying the costly air offensive to better use, such as flattening army formations.
That is the problem when people get to big for their boots. Power corrupts, and some people believe in their own propaganda.
I saw something a little time ago about the French resistance managing to shut down production in Vichy France by shorting out the power grid. As affective as bombing but less costly.
617 Sqn still exists, based at RAF Lossiemouth, and is equipped with Tornado GR4 aircraft. Their motto is ‘Apre Moi Le Deluge’ (After Me, The Flood), a reference to the dam raids, the official name for which was ‘Operation Chastise’. Incidentally, the Howden Dam in South Yorkshire was where the practice flights took place, not Scotland.
More recently, the Sqn earned a battle honour in Gulf War 1, and on Operation Telic (Gulf War 2), carried out the RAF’s first attacks with the Storm Shadow stand-off weapon.
At the time of the dam raids, 617 Sqn’s Officers’ Mess was in a requisitioned house at Woodhall Spa in Lincolnshire. It is now a hotel, which I have been to, complete with Sqn bar containing some interesting memorabilia:
Back in my teenage years in the 1980s, I had a female friend, who´s father was an armourer of the police bomb disposal service of the German state of Northrhine-Westfalia.
Her father told me that at some time in the 1970s both the lakes behind the Möhne and Eder dams were drained for maintenance. While doing this, they found several unexploded bouncing bombs in the mud. They were allmade safe and AFAIK given to museums (I think they kept one for their HQ).
Dr. Wallis also developed the Tall Boy bombs, which were used to crack the German U-boat bunkers on France and the 10 ton Grand Slam Earthquake bomb, the heaviest conventional bomb used in WW2. It reached supersonic speed during free fall and drilled itself 30 meters into the ground before exploding.
The Lancaster bomber could only carry one at a time.
Jan
Edit for factual error
If you ever have the chance to visit 617 Sqn, they have all the ww2 bombs on display outside the squadron, very impressive they are. Find out more about them and the RAF in general here:
Find out more about them and the RAF in general here
Why would you want to? (The RAF i mean) :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Where on earth did the rumour get out that the Yanks invented the bouncing bomb?
It was all British.
I beleive that the crews of the Dam buster bombers were different to other Lancasters. In that they had a dedicated front gunner aswell, this task usually being for the bomb aimer who would look down when needed. In the raid, they needed a presence in the front for the entire run at the dam, thus the special stirrups arrangement to keep the gunners feet out of the aimers head.
The bombs were also tested from Mosquetos I believe. Although they were smaller, as Barnes Wallace had to prove they would work prior to getting full funding and the ever scarce matierials.
The Mosquito version was called “Highball” and was designed to be used against shipping.
Bluffcove was demonstrating a gentle stirring action. I think this thread may even have been a response to IRONMAN’s inspired claim that the Spitfire was designed and manufactured in America by Americans. Luckily since then all the dullards and idiots have been purged from the forum. Or maybe not, looking at some of the other threads.