Somebody's in big trouble

Off-Topic Off Topic - Militaria
#1

Mistaken live ammo injures 17 in France
Mon, 30 Jun 2008 05:49:32

In a bizarre incident, seventeen people are injured when soldiers fired live bullets instead of blanks in an open day display in France.

Fifteen civilians, including five children, and two soldiers were injured in the incident, which took place on Sunday.

The incident involved a demonstration by members of a French marines parachute regiment, of hostage liberation exercises at the Laperrine military barracks, which houses the 3rd marine infantry parachute regiment.

Four of the 17 were seriously injured, with two being in a critical condition following the “incomprehensible” scenes at the barracks near Carcassone, in the country’s south-west, AFP reported.

Meanwhile, five helicopters, 11 firefighters’ first-aid vehicles and two ambulances have rushed to the scene of the incident to help the injured.

One soldier has been detained, while no explanation has been given with regards to why the wrong ammunition was loaded into the weapons.

Elsewhere, a national police spokesman said late on Sunday, “All hypotheses are being considered”, while adding that the weapons had been “seized and placed under lock and key”.

Hospitals in the towns of Toulouse, Narbonne, Montpellier and Perpignan, as well as Carcassone, were providing treatment.

According to a presidential statement, French President Nicolas Sarkozy awaits the results of an urgent top-level military probe into the incident.

The statement said, Sarkozy “shares with the families the pain caused by this drama. My first thoughts are with the victims. Everything will be put in place to care for them”.

France’s Defense Minister Herve Morin traveled to Carcassonne on Sunday evening to visit the injured, while Sarkozy was due to visit the injured in the hospitals in Carcassonne and Toulouse.

The latest information given by the chief of the regional administration in Aude in southeast France, Bernard Lemaire is that investigators believe the deadly ammunition was loaded by mistake.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=62006&sectionid=351020603

#2

Pretty shocking that that can even happen!

#3

News reports indicate that the shooter had live rounds from a previous exercise and loaded them in error.

Looks like he hit the French army chief as well, as heads begin to roll.

French army chief resigns after shooting
By CECILE ROUX – 5 hours ago

PARIS (AP) — France’s army chief resigned Tuesday following a weekend military show in which 16 people were shot and wounded when real bullets were used instead of blanks. 's resignation, Sarkozy’s office said Tuesday, and the defense minister suspended the use of blank munitions at public military shows.

The soldier who fired the bullets was handed preliminary charges for involuntary injury. The 28-year-old had been taken into custody soon after Sunday’s display of hostage-freeing techniques at the Laperrine military barracks in southern France, in which 16 people were hit.

Most of those injured were civilians, and three were children. Officials at a hospital in Toulouse, where five of the victims were being treated, said their condition was stable. A day earlier, hospital officials had said none of the injuries appeared life-threatening.

Officials had earlier said 17 people were injured, but Montpellier Prosecutor Brice Robin on Tuesday put the total at 16.

In a statement, Cuche said his decision to resign was a direct response to the incident.

“As the military chief, I must fully accept my responsibilities,” the statement said.

Speaking on France-Info radio, Defense Minister Herve Morin praised Cuche, describing him as “a man with a conscience” who had made the decision to resign and had not been forced out.

“He felt that the … tragedy, beyond the incident linked to personal mistakes, revealed organizational defaults, malfunctionings,” Morin later told reporters. He added that the general had raised the possibility of resigning on Sunday.

The military blamed the shooting, at a parachute regiment’s open day for the public, on “serious failings.”

Robin said the shooting appeared to be unintentional.

“According to his (the soldier’s) early statements, it appears that he made a mistake while loading his gun,” Robin said. “This act was absolutely not premeditated; I want to be clear about this point.”

The soldier said he “forgot” to hand in unused bullets, as rules stipulate, and then mistakenly loaded his weapon with those munitions, Robin said.

The soldier, a sergeant, was placed under judicial control and freed pending the investigation.

Under French law, preliminary charges mean investigating judges have strong reason to suspect involvement in a crime. Judges decide later if there is enough evidence for a trial.

Without waiting for the results of the judicial and military investigations, Morin ordered the army chief of staff to prepare punishments for those responsible, the ministry said in a statement. It did not elaborate on what the sanctions would be.

Sarkozy had promised there would be “consequences” after the shooting.

(This version CORRECTS number of injured to 16, not 17, reflecting new remarks by prosecutor.)
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iMar5EEaNMu_nlz_U29uU92NWmoQD91L7RR00

#4

How you can mistook blank with live ammo ? :shock:

Those are completely different rounds, is crazy.

#5

I assume he had a mag already loaded, but how stupid would he have to be to have it on him during that sort of exercise?

It wasn’t the only mix up that contributed to the injuries. One of the news reports I haven’t posted said that the organisers have been criticised for having an actor playing a terrorist in the crowd, so that rounds were apparently fired in that direction.

#6

So, even allowing for drama - we can surmise that French Marine hostage response tactics aren’t very good…

#7

And their accuracy or the lethality of their weapons might leave something to be desired. Sixteen hit and no deaths. Then again, in that sort of display people aren’t necessarily aiming as carefully as they would in action.

#8

Rumour has it that the injuries weren’t caused by complete bullets but rather by the fragments of bullet and bits of blank firing attachment expelled after the first few rounds broke up when hitting the BFA. This would explain why various small children managed to get hit multiple times in the heart and survive.

#9

Well, if the Unites states can accidentally load live NUCLEAR BOMBS on its planes and not know where the bombs were for hours afterwards(like few mths ago when this really did happen)…then I guess mistaking live rounds for blanks is small potatoes in relevance to the :Opps I forgot" excuse…

#10

I’ve read an interesting article that US air forces and Navy lost several small Nuclear charges for 40 years in different places around world’s ocean.
Once, i rmember , the Nato bomber losed a bomb right after the take-off from the aircraft carrier.
The other one was a atom-submarine with nuclear wearpons ( seems Tresher ) were sunked with all of crew.
USSR also has a lot of simular cases.

#11

Seems that the french army hasn’t improved since WW2 after all…

#12

I am shocked. I thought this could only happen if it were Canada!..but if thats true that there have been more than one incident then I am speechless:shock:

#13

now your talkin sense! g’job hermanmeister!

#14

Them french, they get so bored that they shoot there own. tsk tsk

#15

I spent some time training with elements of the French Army. The line infantry were conscripts and had a serious problem with NFI all the way to sergeant major level. They just wanted to get their time in and leave.

The others I trained with were the 2eme R’egiment Etranger Parachutiste. A totally different kettle of fish. Professional to the core. Many of them were former British Paras. These are the chaps responsible for the French CRW and they are bloody good.

#16

2 REP :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r9LNXFvugk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0JgxvVHFkI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4rAzYcRbQs&feature=related

#17

What do ya expect its the french for gods sake

#18

Justify that statement or retract it. Or I’ll do it for you. You have 24 hours.

#19

LOL, Who are we to criticize? Our Vice president shot a guy in the face with a shotgun while bird hunting!!

#20

Forgive My ignorance here, but I had in mind “most” forces had mags marked externally and used for different rounds, some for “parades/displays” only?

The NZ Forces do it that way, so, for eg, a mag with a small yellow stripe might be “blanks only” loaded, while a small red stripe on a mag would make it “live rounds only”. As I recall they’ve done something similar to that for decades.

Would have thought similar would exist in other Forces abroad.?

Regards, Uyraell.