Submarine Aircraft Carriers/Cruisers

Submarine Aircraft Carriers (SAC) were developed prior to the Second World War, however there were various countries that carried on their development just before and during the second world war.

The allied forces seemed to have discounted the idea prior to the outbreak of the war, although the French had a huge SAC, almost a cruiser at the start of the war, Surcouf. The British M-2, a modified M-Class Submarine Cruiser, was the first to carry an aircraft, which was housed in a hanger to the front of her conning tower. The M-Class was a development of the K-Class and carried a single 12in gun (that could be fired from submerged, with only the gun barrel and the periscope out of the water. The muzzle had a bead fitted which made aiming possible in a similar fashion to a rifle, reloading had to occur on the surface). The Japanese and the Germans similarly toyed with the idea during hte war. The giant I-400 was designed with the idea of destroying the Panama Canal and slowing the onslaught against the Japanese.

Surcouf’s keil was laid in December 1927, launched 18 October 1929 and commissioned in to the French Navy during May 1934. In 1939 Surcouf was the largest submarine in the world. Her short wartime career is laced with controversy and conspiracy theories.

She was actually designed as an “underwater cruiser,” intended to seek and engage in surface combat. For recconaisance she carried an observation float plane in a hangar built into the after part of the conning tower. For take off and landing the plane would use the sea, taxi to the sub and be winched on and off board by a crane.

For battle she was armed with twelve torpedo tubes and a twin eight-inch (203 mm) gun turret forward of the conning tower. The guns were fed from a magazine holding 600 rounds and controlled by a director with a 40 foot (12 m) rangefinder, mounted high enough to view a seven-mile horizon. In theory, the observation plane could direct fire out to the guns’ 15 mile (24 km) maximum range. AA cannon and machine guns were mounted on the top of the aircraft hangar.

Surcouf also carried a 5-metre motorboat, and contained a cargo compartment with fittings to restrain up to 40 prisoners. The submarine’s fuel tanks carried enough fuel for a 10,000-nautical-mile range and supplies for 90-day patrols could be carried. 600 rounds for the 8 in guns were carried.

She was one of three “corsair” boats (only one was built in the end) designed to get around the Washington Naval Treaty, which had placed strict limits on naval construction by the major naval powers such as Great Britain, France Germany and America. The Treaty omitted any controls over submarines, yet strictly controlled the building of other surface combattents.

The British got around the treaty by creating the Armoured Merchant Cruisers (AKA Admiralty Made Coffin), these being merchant vessels with strong points built in to receive weapons. In the event they were not very effective, except as extra defence for the Atlantic Convoys. These are not to be confused with the Q boats or other Merchant Men that were armed or equiped with aircraft during hostilities.

In 1940, In 1940, Surcouf was based at Cherbourg. But in June 1940, when the Germans invaded, she was being refitted at Brest. Under the power of only one engine and with a jammed rudder, she limped across the English Channel and sought refuge in Plymouth.

On 3 July the British, concerned that the French Fleet would be taken over by the German Kriegsmarine when the French surrendered and the throught the collabration of the Vichy governemnt, executed Operation Catapult.

The Royal Navy blockaded the harbours where French warships were anchored and delivered an ultimatum: re-join the fight against Germany, be put out of reach of the Germans or scuttle the ships. Most accepted willingly, with two notable exceptions: the North African fleet at Mers-el-Kebir and the ships based at Dakar. These prompted the British “treachery” and the French ships suffered hundreds of casualties when the British opened fire.

In Plymouth, Surcouf also resisted and in capturing the submarine, two British officers and one French sailor were killed as a Royal Navy boarding party boarded her under the Op Catapult ultimatum.

The French bitterness caused by these actions escalated when the British attempted to repatriate the captured French sailors (note: these were the sailors who wished to go home, not the volunteers for the Free French Forces which included Army, Navy and Air Force personnel, Frenchmen rescued from Dunkirk were similarly repatriated if they wished when Franch surrendered) the British hospital ship that was carrying them back to France was sunk by the Germans, and many of the French blamed the British for the deaths.

Surcouf returned to the fight in August 1940, after being refitted by the British. She was given to the Free French Forces Navy ( and joined the remainder of the French Fleet (Forces Navales Françaises Libres, FNFL). Her Captain was Louis Blaison (the only officer not repatriated from the original crew). Because of the British-French tensions with regard to the submarine, accusations were made by each side that the other was spying for Vichy France; the British also claimed that Surcouf was attacking British ships. Later, a British officer and two sailors were put on board for “liaison” purposes.

During the war, she was involved in the Dec 1941 retaking of Saint-Pierre and Miquelon (a French archipelago some 30 kilometres south of Newfoundland) from Vichy control (Free France being a sort of state with out a nation). On 20 December, they joined the Free French corvettes Mimosa, Aconit, and Alysse, and on 24 December took control of the islands for Free France without resistance.

One rumour associated with this event is that, on 1 January 1942, Roosevelt dispatched an American destroyer to Saint-Pierre to restore it to Vichy control. Surcouf allegedly fired on the destroyer, killing one or two American sailors.

No documentation supports this rumour, and significant circumstantial evidence contradicts it. It is documented that later that January the Free French decided to send Surcouf to the Pacific theater of war after she resupplied at Bermuda. Her movement south triggered rumours that she was going to liberate the island of Martinique for the Free French from Vichy control.

On 18 February 1942, Surcouf was lost with all hands. An official joint U.S. and Free French report stated that she left Bermuda on 12 February and was accidentally rammed and sunk by the American freighter Thompson Lykes near the Panama canal.

The report stated that the accident was due to both vessels running at night with no lights because of the menace of German U-boats. A later French investigation commission stated that the Surcouf had been sunk by US planes in the morning of the 18th in a “friendly fire” accident.

Like so much else about Surcouf, there are alternate/contradicting stories of her end. Disregarding her being swallowed by the Bermuda Triangle, one of the most popular is that she was caught in Long Island Sound refueling a German U-boat, and both submarines were sunk, either by the American submarines Mackerel (SS-204) and Marlin (SS-205) or a United States Coast Guard blimp.

Many stories add that much of the gold from the French Treasury was in Surcouf’s large cargo compartment, and that the wreck was found and entered in 1967 by Jacques Cousteau.

Personnally I don’t believe that she would have carried any French Treasury Gold, there would not have been time to unload it during June 1940, and the subsequent boarding by the Royal Navy during Op Catapult would surely have brought such a load to light. It may have come from else where but it seems a bit far fetched, and probably originated at the same time as the stories about the U-Boats laden with Nazi gold.

The plane she carried was a MB.411, specifically designed to be carried by Surcouf. it was a low-wing monoplanes with a single central float and two small stabilizing outrigger floats, that could easily be disassembled for stowage. Three aircraft were built, one MB.410 and two MB.411s were built; one MB.411 was carried on board. The aircraft were all similar and carried a crew of 1 or 2.

And now a few pics of the Surcouf.

This one may be prewar as she is flying the French Tri-colour rather than the Free French cross, below.

Free French Training unit flag. (The flag is similar to the ensign of the FNFL, below, but with proportion 1:2 (1.30 m x 2.60 m). It was manufactured in England. The flag is now preserved in the Célestins barracks of the Republican Guard in Paris

Free French Naval Ensign

End of part 1

Part two.


The aircraft being assembled. You can see how small the “hanger” was. THe crane folded in there with the aircraft holding the plane in place it also was used to bring the main body out again. The wings were stowed to the sides of the “hanger”. I beleive the float collapsed against the main body. The crane holding the main body up for construction, and to bring hte plane back on board.


The twin 8in guns in their turret.

End of part 1.


As you can see the Surcouf owed more of her design to surface ships than she did Subs and was multi decked.

General Characteristics
Displacement: 3250 tons surfaced
4304 tons submerged
2880 tons dead
Length: 110 metres (361 feet)
Beam: 9 metres (29.5 feet)
Draught: 7.25 metres (23.8 feet)
Propulsion: surfaced: two Sulzer diesel engines 7600hp
submerged: two electric motors 3400hp two propellers
Speed: 18.5 knots surfaced 10 knots submerged
Range: 18,500 kilometres (10,000 nautical miles) at 10 knots surfaced
12,600 kilometres (6800 nautical miles) at 13.5 knots surfaced
130 kilometres (70 nautical miles) at 4.5 knots submerged
110 kilometres (60 nautical miles) at 5 knots submerged
Test depth: 80 metres (250 feet)
Capacity: 280 tons
Complement: eight officers, 110 men
Armament: two 203 mm (eight-inch) guns in twin turret
two 37 mm antiaircraft cannon
four 13.2 mm antiaircraft machineguns
eight 550 mm torpedo tubes (14 torpedoes carried)
four 400 mm torpedo tubes (eight torpedoes carried)
Aircraft carried: one Besson MB.411 float plane

Aircraft characteristics.
Engines: one 130 kW Salmson 9Nd
Wing Span: 12 metres
Length: 8.25 metres
Height: 2.85 metres
Wing Area: 22 square metres
Weight: 760 kilograms empty, 1140 kilograms loaded
Speed: 185 km/h
Range: 345 kilometres


The modern Surcouf.

Surcouf was named after Robert Surcouf (December 1773–8 July 1827), a famous French privateer. During his legendary career, he captured 47 ships and was renowned for his gallantry and chivalry, earning the nickname of Roi des Corsaires (“King of Privateers”). Surcouf was born in December 1773 in Saint-Malo, a fortified town in Brittany, traditionally a corsair stronghold.

As you can see the role of “corsair cruiser” was similar to, perhaps the Kriegsmarine Pocket Battleship. The Surcouf would not need to be as big as ships such as Graf Spee though, as she coudl hide beneath the waves

Thanx for the info.

Ok, on with the show.

I am not going to do the M-2 for a while as it needs a bit of research (pre war anyway).

Now for the other biggy. Surcouf was the largest submarine at the START of the war. The Japanese, along with the largest guns ever fitted to a ship (18in on the Yamato and Musashi with plans to put 20in guns on two "Super Yamato class ships), also hold the title of the largest (non-nuclear) submarine ever built.

They embraced the idea of SAC to an extent that no other country, before or since has matched. In total they designed and commisioned 47 Submarines, most capable of carrying one aircraft, yet the two AM Class could carry two each and the I-400 class could carry 3 aircraft.

They weren’t too shy about their use either. The B1 (the smallest of the SAC classes) class I-25 became part of the only aerial raid on the US mainland

In June 1942 I-25, on patrol off the coast of Oregon, shelled Battery Russell, a small coastal army installation within Fort Stevens. Damage was minimal. In fact, the only item of significance destroyed on the fort was a baseball backstop.

On September 9, 1942, the crew deployed the Glen aircraft, which dropped incendiary bombs over Oregon forest land, in the first ever time that the continental United States was bombed from the air, known as “The Lookout Air Raid”. The goal was to trigger wildfires across the coast, but light winds, wet weather conditions and two quick acting Fire Lookouts kept the fires under control. In fact, had the winds been sufficiently brisk to stoke widespread forest fires, the lightweight Glen would have been unable to fly.

I-25 was sunk less than a year later by the destroyer USS Patterson off the New Hebrides islands on September 3, 1943.

These raids should not be confused with the “Devine wind” attacks on the west coast of America, by balloons.

The Panama Canal plan consisted of an I-400 class submarine sailing West from Japan, throught the Indian Sea and around Africa, to then attack the Gatun Locks believed to be undefended. The aerial mission is beleived to be have been oneway, as none expected to survive the attack. In anyevent, it is doubtful the mother ship could have recovered the aircraft safely after the event.

The I-400 was designed for world wide operations, and attacks on Washington were also planned.

The Sen Toku I-400 class submarines of the Imperial Japanese Navy (IJN)were the largest submarines of WW2, the largest non-nuclear submarines ever constructed, and the largest in the world until the development of nuclear ballistic submarines in the 1960s.

These submarine aircraft carriers were able to carry 3 Aichi M6A Seiran aircraft underwater to their destinations. They also carried torpedoes for close range combat and were designed to surface, launch the planes then dive again quickly before they were discovered. It is important to note that these SACs were specifically designed to attack targets by the aircraft, rather than using them as observation aircraft as most other navies did.

The I-400 was designed so that it could travelto anywhere in the world, and it was specifically intended to carry out a mission to destroy the U.S.-controlled Panama Canal.

A fleet of 18 boats was planned in 1942, and work on the first one was started in January 1943 at the Kure, Hiroshima arsenal. Within a year the plan was scaled back to five, and only three (the I-400 at Kure, and the I-401 and I-402 at Sasebo) were completed.

Although the U.S. Navy remained discreet about it at the time, the Japanese were ahead of the Allies in many aspects of submarine development and underwater weapons. The Japanese had 30 different classes of submarines — from the one-man suicide torpedoes to the giant I-400 class of aircraft carriers, and used the world’s most efficient torpedoes, the Type 95 or Long Lance.

The Americans also prevented the Russians from viewing the submarines. First by scuttling the majority of the captures SACs off “Point Deep Six” (about 40 miles (60 km) west from Nagasaki and off the island of Goto) as part of Operation Road’s End (the name coming from the traditional depth of a Sea Funeral, 6 fathoms or more hence “Deep Six”. 5 subs avoided this grave by having a speed of double that of American subs at the time. These were speeded to Hawaii for inspection, but again met their watery fate when the Russians demanded access.

Each submarine had four 3,000 horsepower (2.2 MW) engines and enough fuel to cicumnavigate the globe one-and-a-half times. They displaced 6,500 tons and was over 400 feet (120 m) long, three times the size of ordinary submarines. They used a figure-eight hull shape for additional strength to handle the on-deck hangar for housing the three aircraft. In addition, they carried four antiaircraft guns and a large deck cannon as well as eight torpedo tubes.


a model showing an I-400 class boat.


The real deal.

Put this in to the Italian Subs thread so will post it here as well.

The Regia Marina (Italian Navy) developed, in the late 1920s, the Ettore Fieramosca, a submarine with a waterproof hangar for a small reconnaissance plane. They gave commissions to the Italian aircraft manufacturers Macchi and Piaggio for two prototypes. The Macchi M.53 and the Piaggio P.8 were developed by 1928, but the program for an Italian aircraft-carrying submarine was cancelled, and the hangar was removed from the submarine in December 1931, before the Ettore Fieramosca was delivered to the Italian navy.

She, like so many of the other Submarine Aircraft Carriers, proved to be not up to the task of operational cruises. She was used for training only from 1941 onwards.

Displacement.
Surfaced 1556 tons.
Submerged 1965 tons.

Speed
Surfaced 15 knots.
Submerged 8 knots.

Length 84 meters.

Horse power of diesals motors 5200
Horse power of electric engines 2000

Weapons.
8 torpedo tubes with 14 reloads.
1 120mm gun.
4 13.2mm machine guns.
Crew 78.


The Ettore Fieramosca


A drawing of Ettore Fieramosca

The idea of a Sumersible Aircraft Carrier, or Submarine Seacarrier, was first looked in to by the United States in 1922. During WW1 American submarines were technologically backward in comparison to other nations, often relegated to gaurding harbours. To get them any descent distance from the harbour, they were transported on colliers. In 1919, however, the Americans were able to get hold of several of the German U-Boat designs and were able to bring their technology up to spec.

The Narwhal was the first of two general purpose, cruiser submarines designed along the lines of the German U-boats. Although it was considered sluggish and a slow diving design, it continued to operate as a transport submarine during World War II.


The Narwhal, showing it’s more surface ship look.

In heavy seas.

The Cuttlefish improved on the cruiser submarine concept and was basically an Americanized U-boat. This design incorporated a complete double hull and had an 11,000 nm radius at 19 kts.


USS Cuttlefish, showing her broad beam.

The USN purchased two Caspar-Heinkel U-1 disarmable seaplanes for evaluation and testing at Anacostia Naval Station, one of these aircraft was later lost during an exhibition flight in 1923, but this provided useful technical information.

The U.S. Navy accepted the construction of 12 submarine-based aircraft designs from Cox-Klemm Aircraft (New York) with their design XS-1 (1 prototype and 5 preserie planes) and another six were ordered from Glenn L. Martin Aircraft Corporation (Baltimore) with their design MS-1, both small designs were disarmable hydroplanes.

Both models were tested in submarine S-1 during October and November 1923. Later the Cox-Klemm company attempted to developed its design with an XS-2 model, but the Navy lost interest in the concept. In 1931 another similar concept was born when Loening Aircraft Company presented its design Loening XSL-1 Amphibian flying boat for submarine trials aboard the S-1, but this concept was never accepted by the submarine service.

News of the British submarine M-2 sinking during aircraft launching trials in 1933, and the damage of XSL-2 during aquatic testings in Anacostia river area, led to the USN abandoning the whole idea of submarine-borne aircraft and Submarine Aircraft Carriers.

Another consideration was the long time required to assemble or disassemble the aircraft, along with its limited flying range.


Submarine S-1 with plane.

All through the first world war and the between war period the British were also looking in to how to utilise their Submarines to the best effect.

Early Submarines weren’t that big, and as they were made bigger they had the problem of larger amounts of batteries to power the ever larger electric motors to drive their ever expanding size. THis is why many looked like surface war ships I feel. Many would spend as much time on the surface charging the batterys as underwater.

It is worth remembering that up to 1940 it was safer for a Sub to be on the surface at night. And many submarines still had to almost surface in order to engage targets.

Only after the 1940 defeat of the Netherlands by the Germans did they even have the idea of a snorkle. The Dutch had been working on a device that they had named the snuiver (lit: “sniffer”). The Dutch navy had been experimenting as early as 1938 with a simple pipe system on the submarines O-19 and O-20 that enabled them to travel at periscope depth operating on its diesels with almost unlimited underwater range while charging the propulsion batteries.

So then, the British, still figuring how to use it’s submersibles hit upon the “fleet” submarine. This was a submarine capable of keeping up with the newest fleet ships (capable of 24kts). In the fleet they would scout ahead as an early form of submarine screen in battle they would submerge, get around the other side of the enemy fleet and essentially cut them off.

The first submarine to realise this expectation was the K Class (AKA Kalamity class due to the number of problems the RN had with them.


HMS K25. Note the “deck house” around the conning tower, this provided the crew (whislst surfaced) with better protection than the canvas screens used on other subs of hte time. The funnels are the small rectangular protrutions between the mid and aft gun emplacements. In heavy seas water could enter these and put hte fires in the boilers out!!!

The K class, designed in 1913 and first launched in 1915, was powered on the surface by an oil turbine, the K class was the first and last steam propelled subs until the arrival of hte Nuclear powered subs of hte 1950s.

Most K boats were scrapped 1921 - 26, K26 survived until 1931, only being broken up because her displacement exceeded the limits for submarine displacement in the London Naval Treaty of 1930.

Although the concept of a submarine fast enough to operate with a battle fleet eventually fell out of favour, it was still an important consideration in the design of the Thames class in the late 1920s.

The M class replaced the last 4 K class boats ordered and the first one was launched in 1917 (M-1 but never saw action), they were a small class of diesel electric submarine built during World War I. The unique feature of the class was a 12 inch (305 mm) gun mounted in a turret forward of the conning tower.

They were designed to be used as coastal bombardment craft or submarine monitors, but later the role was changed to the destruction of merchant shipping, either surfaced or with just the gun protruding from the surface.

The intention was that merchant ships could be engaged at periscope depth or on the surface using the gun, rather than torpedoes. At that time torpedoes were considered ineffective against moving warships at more than 1000 yards (900 m). Nevertheless it is unlikely that a well-constructed ship would be sunk by a single 12 inch (305 mm) shell hit.

The surfacing and aiming of the gun would take 75 seconds, but the weapon couldn’t be reloaded whilst the boat was submerged, and this operation took 3 minutes to carry out.

The mounting allowed them to elevate by 20 degrees, depress 5 degrees and train 15 degrees in either direction from the centre line. However, in practice the concept was not very successful and only three of the four M-class boats ordered were completed. M-4 was broken up before completion.

M-1, M-2 and M-3 faired little better in 1924 all three completed members of the class were used to test hull camouflage to reduce the visibility of submarines from aircraft—M1 was painted grey-green, M2 dark grey whilst M3 was painted dark blue.

M-3 was converted in 1927 to a minelayer. With stowage for 100 mines, primarily to test the mine-handling equipment of the Porpoise class. The mines were carried on a conveyor belt which ran along her upper deck and covered over by an enlarged casing. The mines were laid through a door at the stern. She was scrapped in 1932 after the trials had been completed

M-1 sank, with all hands, in 1925 after being rammed by the Swediish collier SS Vidar during an exercise in the English Channel.


The M-1 with the fleet.

M2 and her sister M3 were taken out of service and reassigned for experimental use. Both had their guns removed because of the limit in submarine gun calibre of 8 inches imposed by the Washington Naval Treaty, and on the M-2 it was replaced by a small aircraft hangar, the work being completed in 1928. This could carry a small Parnall Peto seaplane, specially designed for the M2 and which could be launched by hydraulic catapult within a few minutes of surfacing.

The aircraft would land alongside the submarine on completion of its sortie and be winched aboard using a crane. The submarine was to operate ahead of the battle fleet in a reconnaissance role, flying off her seaplane as a scout.

She was lost off Chesil Beach on 26 January 1933. It is thought that the hangar door was opened prematurely. M2 left her base at Portland on 26 January 1932, for an exercise in West Bay. Her last communication was a radio message at 10:11 to her Submarine depot ship, HMS Titania to announce that she would dive at 10:30 am.

The captain of a passing merchant ship, the Newcastle coaster Tynsider, mentioned that he had seen a large submarine dive stern first at around 11:15. Unaware of the significance of this, he only reported it in passing once he reached port.

Two explanations have been advanced. The first is that since the crew were always trying to beat their record time for launching the aircraft, they had simply opened the hangar door on surfacing whilst the deck was still awash. The other theory is that the flooding of the hangar was due to failure of the stern hydroplanes. High pressure air tanks were used to bring the boat to the surface in an awash condition but to conserve this limited resource, compressors were then started to completely clear the ballast tanks of water by blowing air into them. This could take as long as 15 minutes to complete. The normal procedure for launching the aircraft was therefore to hold the boat on the surface using the hydroplanes whilst the hangar door was opened and the aircraft launched. Failure of the rear hydroplanes would have sent the stern down as observed by the merchant officers and water would have eventually entered the hangar.

The Royal Navy attempted to salvage M-2, raising her from the 90 meters of her initial sinking point. Ernest Cox, the salvage expert that had raised the German battleships at Scapa Flow was hired to salvage the M2. In an operation lasting nearly a year and 1,500 dives, on 8 December 1932, she was lifted to within six metres of the surface before a gale sprang up, sending her down to her final resting place.


HMS M2 launches her sea plane. Note the up angle of the catapult.


HMS M-2at sea.

End of part 1

Part 2.


HMS M2’s door is closed in this picture.


On the sea bed.

The Germans also had a good look at the idea of putting aircraft on submarines. In their case they also opted for helicopters. The Kriegsmarine started development of submarines capable of launching aircraft and ordered 4 very large “cruiser” U-boats in early 1939. These boats were to be twice as large as any existing U-boat and have a crew of 110. They were intended to carry a single Arado Ar 231 aircraft, but were canceled at the outbreak of war later that year.


The Arado Ar 231 ready for flight.


The Arado Ar 231 folded down for stowage.


Being winched on board the Stier.

The need to be stored inside the submarine necessitated compromises in design that left the single-seat seaplane of little practical use. Testing soon discovered them to be fragile, underpowered, and difficult to fly even during calm weather, and as a result, development ended. Some of that testing was done on the auxiliary cruiser Stier, two of the six prototpes being taken on one voyage.

Another German long range U-boat was the Type IX D 2 “Monsun”, used in the Indian Ocean and Far East Area based in Penang (Occupied Malaya) during wartime.


Only a model, sorry guys.

To aid such submarines the “Autogyro-Glider” Observation vehicle Focke-Achgelis Fa 330 “Bachstelze” (Water Wagtail) was developed. This vehicle was used in the Indian Ocean and sporadically in the Southern Atlantic, since May-June 1942.

The Fa-330 was one of several German “gyro-kites”. It consisted of a seat and an un-powered overhead rotor. The pitch of the blades is such that as the wind strikes them they produce lift. The intent of the Fa-330 was to permit it’s launching from the conning tower of a moving U-boat attached to a cable. The cable would be let out until the Fa-330 had reached sufficient altitude to scan the horizon for merchant ships.

If time permitted, the pilot would be winched back aboard. In an emergency he could disconnect the tow-line in mid-air and either ride the Fa-330 down (it would descend in a controlled manner like an autogiro or a modern helicopter in “auto-rotation”) or come down in a parachute. Perhaps the U-boat would get a chance to re-surface later and pluck him from the sea. Hmmm, top job.

While aloft, the pilot was in contact with the submarine by telephone. In normal return to the sub, the winch wound in the cable until the Fa-330 was on the deck. The emergency procedure however could allow the pilot to jettison the blades and rotor hub. When the rotor assembly separated, it automatically opened a parachute attached to both the machine and the pilot. The pilot then released his safety belt and the aircraft dropped into the sea, leaving the pilot descending alone by parachute.


A Focke-Achgelis Fa 330 “Bachstelze” (Water Wagtail), also referred to as a “Sand Piper”.


Fa 330 in position for launch on the conning tower.

Endof part 1

Part two

Another plan was the use of Flettner Fl 282A “Kolibri” Disarmable recon-helicopter version from long range submarines.

Such project implied the special disarmable one-place helicopter design were its fuselage was manufactured of welded steel tubing that was sized so that it could be stowed with rotor blades and landing gear removed in a compact area (5.9 ft. in diameter by 18 ft. long) and its pressured hangar for carriage in the U-boat plan.


Tests on a ship of some sort.

On the ground


Tests, post-war, by the Americans.

It is worth noting, as shown on this model, thta there were two sets of blades.

There is no evidence that any Fl 282 “Kolibri” was deployed on a German submarine in wartime.

Hi.

Focke-Achgelis FA 330:

The Fa 330 was transported in two water-tight tubes of 3,75 m each mounted besides the conning tower.

It could be assembled by 4 men in 3-7 minutes depending on the weather conditions. It could be disassembled and stored within 5 minutes minimum.

Only the submarines type IX were able to reach the minimum take-off speed by only using the engines. Some FA 330 were used successfully on the type IX D2 subs in the Indian Ocean and the Pacific. In the Atlantic the allied air superiority prevented the use of this gyro most of the time.

Data:

Length: 4500 mm
rotor diameter: 8500 mm
rotor width: 300 mm
height: 1700 mm
minimum take-off speed: 27,2 km/h
maximum speed: 80 km/h
maximum rotor speed: 205 rpm
Maximale ceiling: 220 m
Length of cable: 300 m
weight empty: 80 kg

Yours

tom!

Hi.

Ar 231:

Data:

Length: 7810 mm
span: 10170 mm
height: 3120 mm
power: 180 PS
maximum speed: 170 km/h
range: 500 km
ceiling: 3000 m
weight empty: 840 kg
maximum weight: 1050 kg

Yours

tom! :wink:

Hi.

There is a nice book on japanese submarine aircraft, also giving informations on japanese SAC:

“Japanese Submarine Aircraft” by Tadeusz Januszewski, published by Mushroom Model Publications, Redbourne, UK. ISDN 83-916327-0-9

Japanese Sen Toku class:

Data:

length: 122 m
width: 12 m
height: 7,02 m
engines: 4 X Diesel, 2 X electric
power: 7700 hp, 2400 hp
maximum speed: 18,75 knots, 6,5 knots
maximum range: 37.500 nm at 14 knots
maximum depth: 100 m
crew: 144
armament: 8 torpedo tubes with 20 torpedoes, 1 X type Taisho 14 14 cm gun L/50, 3 X type 96 aa-gun triple mount, 1 X type 96 aa-gun single mount, 3 X M6A1 Seiran

Yours

tom!

Hi.

M6A1 Seiran:

The first prototype was built in October 1943 at Eitoku plant of Aichi Kokubi K. K. at Nagoya. Trial last until summer 1944. in February 1944 the second prototype was ready for trials, six more prototypes were completed until October 1944 with the third ans fourth prototype built with a landing gear for intense flight tests and crew training. These aircraft were renamed M6A1-K Nanzan (K for training aircraft).


M6A1-K Nanzan

Due to a careful design process the trials were finished fast with only few modifications. The “serial” production started in September 1944 with the first Seiran delivered in October 1944 and 4 additional aircraft until December 7th, 1944. On December 7th an earthquake hit Nagoya stopping the production. Only 2 additional aircraft were built until March 1th, 1945 when the Eitoku plant and several local subcontractors were destroyed by US bombers. The plant was rebuilt and 12 aircraft have benn completed until May17th, when the Eitoku plant was bombarded again. The production couldn´t be restarted until the production was ceased due to a change of strategy by the High Command after a new evaluation of the chances of a submarine-based attack was made.

First trials aboard I-400 started in January 1945, the crew training was done atFukuyama naval airbase. During these trainings some problems with the Ha 60-32 engine occured which were not solved totally when in April 1945 a training mission with 3 Seiran on I-400 should be started. At this time the fuel reserves of the naval airforce was at such a low level that only airdefence units and Kaikaze units could be supplied. As the army airforce refused to send fuel I-400 sailed to Dairen to gather aircraft fuel from a depot.

On May 11th, 1945, I400 and I-401 took over six Seiran and sailed to Maizuru naval base which was selected as operation base for 1st Submarine Sqadron. Six week of operational training includig catapult training followed. The time to move all three aircraft out of the hangar, assemble them an to take off was 30 minutes at best with a highly vulnerable submarine. The time until take-off of the third aircraft with no floats (e.g. for suicide missions or missions without recovering the aircraft) was calculated with 14,5 minutes

The innitial idea of an attack against the Panama Canal was dropped after two aircraft collided during training with dummy targets at a large scale model of the Gaton locks. Lack of fuel and a more realistic view on the probbable effects were additional causes.

On June 25th, 1945, the order was given to the 1st Submarine Squadron for a suicide attack against US aircraft carrier at the US supply base Ulithi. I-400 and I-401 should be supported by the submarines I-13 and I-14 and two type AM submarines each carrying a disassembled C6N1 Saium recon aircraft which should be used for recon missions based at Truk.

On August 15th the Sen Toku submarines reached the take-off point near Ulithi and waited for the signal to initiate the attack. On August 16th both submarines were informed of the armistice. Orders were given to destroy all offensive weapons and the six Seiran were pushed overboard.

Data:

total length: 11,640 m
lenght of fuselage: 10,640 m
wing span: 12,262 m
height: 4,58 m
wing area: 27 m²
weight empty: 3301 kg
standard weight: 4040 kg
maximum weight: 4445 kg
useful load: 739 kg
wing loading: 149,63 kg/m²
power plant: Aichi AE1P Atsua 32 (Ha 60-32) 12-cylinder liquid-cooled inverted V engine
power: 1340 hp at 1700 m, 1290 hp at 5000 m
power loading: 2,88 kg/hp
propeller: three-blade all-metal variable pitch
propeller diameter: 3,2 m
fuel tank capacity: 934 l
oil tank capacity: 49 l
maximum speed: 444 km/h at 4200 m
cruising speed: 277 km/3000 m
landing speed: 113 km/h
time to height 3000 m: 5 min 48 sec
ceiling: 9900 m
range: 1200km
endurance: 4 h 15 min
armament: 1 X type 2 13 mm machine gun movable for observer,
bomb load: two 250 kg naval bombs or one 800 kg naval bomb or one type 91 aircraft torpedo

Yours

tom!

Thanks for that Tom, some good pictures there that I have not been able to find.

I’m still looking for some more info on SACs, in particularl the Japanese subs.

I was going to put this out later but will put it up now for the viewers.

They are in japanese but have some good pictures and some good animations, in particular the way the aircraft assembled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCPizDLIiek&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znhmWkGZMc4&mode=related&search=

In the first few seconds of the first link you will see how the floats were stored seperatley to the aircraft and appeared from two slots to the left and right of the catapult rails.

It would take 45 minutes to deploy all three aircraft from the vessel.

Edit to add.

You will find some good footage of carrier operations and the engagement of a Kamikaze by a (and subsequent ramming of) US Ship.

Beautiful topic.

I think that i have a picture of the british experiments of the late 1920s and early 1930.

Thank you very much, those images are very timely as I am just looking for extra details to add to my model.
Any additional photographs you may have would be very appreciated.:slight_smile: :slight_smile: