Britisches Freikorps

True, but reading between the lines of that article it’s pretty clear that he only intended to do so if the Red Army had failed to stop at the Elbe and started heading for France. And I doubt the idea came from the BFC - Churchill came up with enough mad ideas of his own without outside assistance.

Oh come on pdf :wink:
The “article” gets the links to the original source which gives us the full text of this document.
There the exact data of attack - 1 jule of 1945. May be Churchill knew the Red Army should attack him right before in 1 jule :wink:
The idea to use the Germans POW with its own wearpon (!!!) in the fight with Soviets is very close to the Goebbels idea of total fight against “jewish bolshevism” of “UNION Europe”.
That’s funny , but fact which rised up again during Cold war;)

Cheers.

Alas, your too much love and care for me…Are heavy orisons ‘gainst this poor wretch.
If little faults proceeding on distemper…Shall not be winked at, how shall we stretch our eye…When capital crimes, chewed, swallowed, and digested …Appear before us?

There were crooked draft-dodgers, making money selling contraband on the black market, that were probably far more deserving of a death sentence.

As they were tried the Nuremburg trials were in session, or about to be. No need to go into any explanation of those and the subsequent convictions. It reads Like a script from one of those old, black and white, farce movies.

Take ‘Lord Haw Haw’ for instance. Now he was someone that the Nazis really were able to exploit. His defence, when tried, was that he couldn’t have committed treason against the Crown, as he was an American citizen. That didn’t wash as he had taken British citizenship well before the beginning of the war. His treason was blatant and his punishment just.

http://www.nndb.com/people/443/000028359/

These were a bunch of fellows (how many, twenty, was it?) looking for an easy way to survive the war. Some would argue that they were using their initiative in a survival situation. Apart from donning the SS uniform and wasting a lot of a few Nazis’ time, what did they contribute to the Nazi cause - anything?

Several definitly hindered it. At least one was sending back intelligence to the British.

The rest just seemed to drink and go out with lots of German frauleins. Beats sitting in a Stalag.

hmmm Churchill considers using German POW’s in the event of an unprovoked Soviet attack on the Western Allies, and you have the nerve to accuse him of betrayal.
Get a grip :roll:

The aim after capture is to cause as much dislocation and burden as possible to the enemy by avoding capture and escaping.

A dispersed platoon of, say, the Black Watch on the piss, with or without their own or enemy women, should tie up about ten times that number of enemy troops just cleaning up the mess the Black Watch left behind. Capturing them while they’re drunk would need a lot more men. :smiley:

British Free Crops was a unit of captured british troops in german soilders unifroms class as a German unit.Did they ever fight for Germany, and if so did they fight against British soilders.
What happend to them after the war.

They got in prison i guess for many years .

Why don’t you just read about it on Wiki? And if you have any more specific questions, then start a thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Free_Corps

There were too few to ever bother with combat. I believe there was also an attempt to start an American based unit that is written about in Vonnegut’s “Slaughterhouse Five.”

I suspect that this should be a question ? ← can help :wink:

British Free Crops (former called The British Legion of St George) was a unit of “Waffen-SS” for propaganda and was a brainchild of John Amery, an English fascist. After miscarriage of his plan the Germans tried to continue and to enlist British and Dominion prisoners of war. Later on the Germans forced them.

On 8. March 1945 an ultimatum was given to them: Fight at the front or be sent to an concentration camp.
Finally the unit doesn’t come to employment.

After war’s end they were arrested, Amery was executed.

Perhaps she doesn’t trust Wiki :smiley: :wink:

She shouldn’t! :smiley:

One should always be skeptical. But I’m pretty sure we have a thread on this somewhere…

In spite of Nick’s link I post this as it shows different numbers of members and it comes from a german source (and because I already started typing as Nick replied):
from “Europäische Freiwillige” by Ertel/Schulze-Kossens

British Free Corps (B.F.C.)

About 70 men served in the B.F.C. of the Waffen SS.
The aims and principles of the B.F.C. as laid down in its own propaganda were:
The British Fee Corps is a thoroughly British volunteer unit, conceived and created by British subjects from all parts of the Empire who have taken up arms and pledged their lives in the common European struggle against Soviet Russia.
The British Free Corps will neither make war against Britain or the British Crown nor support any action or policy detrimental to the interests of the British people. The Wehrmacht having disclaimed any interest in either a legion of “Saint George” or a British Free Corps. So it was assigned to the Waffen SS. The commander of the B.F.C. was Hauptsturmführer (Captain) Johannes Roggenfeld of the “Wiking” division who had lived in the USA and spoke english fluently. According to Dr. K. G. Klietmann ("Die Waffen SS, a documentary) it was Hauptsturmführer Roepke, followed (in November 1944) by Obersturmführer (1st Lieutenant) Kuehlich. Uniform was standard field-grey with a mountain cap with a death’s head on the front. It would seem that the special Three Lion collar patch, cuff title and armshield started to be issued in April 1944. Prior to that the collar patch had been either the normal SS runes or a plain black one. With astonishing arrogance the Britons objected to having to wear the Union Jack below the SS eagle and, incredibly, obtained permission to wear it above! In the Waffen SS the Freikorps was trained as an Assault Engineer Unit, and for this purpose it was sent to Dresden. There it suffered its first casualties when, ironically, two of its members were killed in the course of the celebrated fireraid on that city by the RAF! In March the unit was assigned to the “Nordland” division, which at the time was in process of refitting. Before the “Nordland” was ready to return to action, the majority of the Freikorps volunteers had decided to opt out. Only five remained on active service with the “Nordland” and of these one was on non-combatant duty as a Medical Orderly (his previous function in the British Army). The other four fought as infantry men. One fell in action, one escaped from Berlin, the other two were captured by the Russians who handed them over the British authorities.

Yes, I’ve found this one:slight_smile:

Thank you, I’ll merge them…

Anyone else heard of this? It doesn’t feel like it’s been covered much, probably because it’s embarassing / shameful.

The only reason I know anything about them is because of a History Channel documentary, but maybe that’s my own general ignorance.

Personally I found it hard to swallow the excuses given by the one or two individuals they could find and encourage to do an interview. “We were told we wouldn’t be shooting at Brits, just Russians”… Well, that’s okay, you were only okay with killing your own allies! You were only okay with fighting for the enemy in an SS uniform…

Sorry, the bile was rising again. There was an old fellow, an Australian (used to be English), that didn’t want to talk to them (not surprised). It got to me that he was drawing an army pension when he was really a traitor! :evil:

Sorry to bang on, but for those who don’t know, the BFC was ostensibly an SS unit of British prisoners. Admittedly they didn’t do much because the Nazis were never certain they could trust them. Also, from several thousand (I think) POWS, they could only get something like 50 volunteers (I’ll check, it may have been even less)! I guess that’s us Brits for you. The uniform was like an SS one…with a Union Jack on one arm. Gack! They were all told they would only fight against the Soviet Union.

Here should be a load of info on this topic:
http://ww2incolor.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4484&highlight=britische

If you’d like the thread to be re-opened, let us know.

The French in the SS Charlemagne had the same deal to fight only against the Soviet union.You have to understand that fear and hatred of communism was very strong during(and after) WW2.
I think PDF27 know a thing or two about the Brits in the SS but don’t expect a lot of volunteers,well not as much as the Dutch,Belgian or French anyway.

I’ve never been in the military…never been in a combat zone, so I have to be careful not to become an armchair General full of bluster and such…

BUT ; it is a bee in my bonnet, that some folks would fight on behalf of the enemy…for any reason. Still, it was 60 years ago - it’s too easy for me to make judgements from my living room.

Original thread re-opened and both BFC threads merged.

One thing about the BFC - a very substantial proportion of the members seem to have been working for various British military intelligence organisations. These seem to have arranged the transfer in of various PoWs for short periods of time because the BFC offered an atmosphere rather like Butlins for the PoWs in it - better food and living conditions than in the PoW camps, coupled with the fact that the unit was of no use whatsoever to the Germans meant that any British PoWs who joined it were damaging the German war effort!