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#181

IRONMAN you have a very distorted view of Islam. Maybe you should go to school and take a course on the History of Western Religous thought. Ya know most muslims believe in Jesus. But they differ in the fact that the dont believe he was the son of god. You are going on just about the same thing they are. A half ass understanding of the situation. Because from where im sitting it would seem that you have targeted Islam as the root of terrorism and I can assure you that those who adhere to the real teachings of Islam are not the terrorists. There are always bad apples in the bunch. Take a look at Catholics. Now maybe the arent killing people but there seem to be a long string of child molestation in the Catholics church. Does that mean that Catholicism inspires child molestation?

Think you might need to do a bit more research and reading on this one. It would appear that you are looking for the bad sides of something. Well dont be surprised when you find them. :wink: Try looking at the other aspects of the religion.

#182

[quote=“IRONMAN”][quote=“2nd of foot”]

The Qouran has numerous statements of hatred toward Christians and statements that they must be killed and eliminated form the earth.

False. Show me where in the Koran it is written that they must kill Christians?

Did you not read my previous post of this? There are numerous passages in the Quoran that bespeak of killing the Christians (unbelievers or “People of the Book” as the Quoran states).[/qote]

But you have not shown “Kill Christians”.

O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. [al-Ma’idah 5:51.11]

No killing there.

Whoever changes his Islamic religion, kill him. Sahih Al-Bukhari (9:57)

Bit like the inquisition, but still no killing Christians.

Slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush. (Koran 9:5)

Seem to think one of the ten was do not bow down to idols, so they are on about the same thing as Christians.

Take him and fetter him and expose him to hell fire. (Koran 69:30-37)

Who?

I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers, Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips of them. (Koran 8:12)

Christians believe in the same god as Muslims so cannot be unbelievers.

They (the unbelievers) should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides. (Koran 5:33)

Same as above.

So again show me where it is written “kill Christians”.

#183

CHeers Sandworm, I agree, the extremist groups want to make the West see only the bad side, it enourages Xenophobia, fear and even terror, the exact things necessary in order to create a conflict from which they can increase their poltiical standings.

But Sandworm I think the words you were really looking for were.

SHUT THE FUCK UP BEFORE AN OTHERWISE MODERATE MUSLIM READS THIS AND CONCLUDES WE ALL THINK THEY ARE BARBARIC, INARTICULATE UNEDUCATED SIMPLETONS.

#184

2nd of foot, more importantly it does not state who does the smiting the killing the chopping etc.

Alot of the retribution for misdeeds was to be carried out after the day of judgement, all men being given till the very last moment of their lives to turn to th teachings of Allah.

#185

IRONMAN you have a very distorted view of Islam. Maybe you should go to school and take a course on the History of Western Religous thought. Ya know most muslims believe in Jesus. But they differ in the fact that the dont believe he was the son of god. You are going on just about the same thing they are. A half ass understanding of the situation. Because from where im sitting it would seem that you have targeted Islam as the root of terrorism and I can assure you that those who adhere to the real teachings of Islam are not the terrorists. There are always bad apples in the bunch. Take a look at Catholics. Now maybe the arent killing people but there seem to be a long string of child molestation in the Catholics church. Does that mean that Catholicism inspires child molestation?

Think you might need to do a bit more research and reading on this one. It would appear that you are looking for the bad sides of something. Well dont be surprised when you find them. :wink: Try looking at the other aspects of the religion.[/quote]

I understand that there are other aspects of the religion. I have not stated that i hate Muslims or want them to persish or any such thing. That is not my feelings. I know that there are good people who are Muslim. ofcourse. However, I also understand that the Qouran teaches that Christians are to be disliked and killed. What is hard to understand about the fact that as long as there are Muslims willing to act on the words of the Qouran there will be Islamic terrorists?

You state “the real teachings of Islam”. The passages from the Qouran that I quoted are as real as anything else in it. They are not ignored or taken out of the book. They are a part of the real teachings of Islam as well.

I also stated that Muslims must become diligent about stopping terrorists within their country. This is essential for there to be a great reduction in the terrorists coming from Middle Eastern countries.

#186

really,i dont thought that,i have actually muslim friends,im Christian and they dont want to kill me.

we should tolerate every religion,if we don`t want to be persecuted by the other religious.

and,about terrorism,i SEE everyday Uniformed Terrorist in Irak,and the AREN`T muslims.

#187

you have quote the words, out of context, without any of the revelent associated teaching!

You are pissing in the wind. Im presently trying to recruit a very knoweldgable muslim from another site to educate you

#188

Another great early mornings cyber entertainment lads, Boneman has plummed new depths in knobendedness. It’s like reading a rightwing talk radio script. Sweeping statements, swithching emphasis and then that muslim friend ( yes right not if he reads this site ). I’m supprised he has’nt been swept up by the daily mail or Fox News.

As a holy roller, the answer to the question of why muslims choose the catholic education system in the UK is that it tends to be single sex from year 7( secondary)

Oh and I claim all rights to the word knobendedness and have submited my designs to the patent office, While I accept that kobendedness may have used by other posters on another site(arrse) my knobendedness is different and works better.

#189

OK So there has not been a pouring of Mulsim terrorists into Iraq from other countries since Iraq 2 began.

There are no more Muslim terrorists in the world than terrorists of other religions.

The bombings in Britain recently were commited by Laplander extremists.

The twin towers on 9-11 were brought down by pissed off Kinkos employees.

And the Quran states that Christians are to be respected and befriended.

:roll:

#190

IRA are ?
INLA are?
UDA are?
ETA are ?
FARC are ?
shining path are?
Timmothy Mc Vie was?
Contras are ?

America is new to the War on Terrorism (WoT)Although I prefer the War against Terrorism accronym(TWaT).
The only country in the western world that equates the word terrorist with a religion and skin tone is America.

You are looking at the whole situation in Iraq from Nationalist point of view ie, twenty six dead children count less than one GI.
The fact is that the vast majority of Muslims do not espose the views you believe they do. Extremists make up only a very small part of any given population, it’s just that they make more noise.

In simple term terrorism can be seen as cause and effect, if you fail to address the cause you have to live with the effect.

The sky isn’t falling chicken little

#191

On page nine of this thread

I believe it was just a badly laid out post rather than an attempt to change the original quote as others have been known to.
I had to read his post a couple of times to understand it correctly.

I think that it should read like this:

[quote=“Bluffcove”]

There was a little thing called the Sacking of Jeruslalem, Saladdin, and Moors occupation of Spain, However Christians do not “Hate Muslims” 2000 years on (although the attitude of certain persons makes this questionable)[/quote]But that’s just my idea I’ve not asked Bluff, to whom I apologise if I’ve done this incorrectly.

This statement does not surprise me, the said poster tends to read what he wishes see rather than what is actually written. If he had he’d have seen that it is a riposte.

#192

As far as I am aware, Britain has never napalmed a single civillian village - unless of course Bessbrook, Crossmaglen and Forkhill were all charred messes when I was there and I missed it?

Oh and (sorry about this Mods) - fuck off you sanctimonious, patronising twat. Who the fuck do you think you are, you fucking knobhead?

#193

I’ve given you my opinion at least 3 times - you seem to be ignoring it because it’s different to yours.

#194

[quote="“IRONMAN”"]

The Qu’uran teaches that Jews and Christians are “People of the Book”, and as such, are not grouped with the unbelievers, nor are they considered idolators.
The reference to “Whoever changes his Islamic religion, kill him” is in reference to apostates, i.e. converts away from Islam, not to Christians or Jews, since they did not hold to Islam to begin with.
The other quotes are entirely irrelevant to either Jews or Christians.
Please, show one reference to Muslims killing “People of the Book” from the Qu’uran. Just one.
As for the PIRA/INLA/CIRA/RIRA. etc etc, if there is, indeed a “War on Terror” then it is seamless and universal. It has to be by definition.
You cannot say, oh, let’s have a War on Terror, so long as it’s terror by Muslims…the rest can go on bombing at will.
Terrorist organisations cross-train just like western armies do.
IRA men trained in Hezbollah camps in Lebanon, and were armed by, among others, Qaddafi of Libya.
They, in turn, have trained FARC rebels and others.

#195

Has anyone here heard of Nelly the Elephant?

Nelly is Pink.
Nelly is an Elephant.
What colour are elephants?

Shehzad Tanweer, Hasib Mir Hussain and Mohammed Sadique Khan are terrorists.
Shehzad Tanweer, Hasib Mir Hussain and Mohammed Sadique Khan are Muslim.
Are Muslims terrorists?

It’s a little disingenuous, as pink and elephants are utterly unconnected (as far as we know) whereas there is a link between Islam and terrorism. However, it illustrates the point that I am trying to make - drawing conclusions with insufficient evidence can lead to completely wrong solutions, like “Elephants are pink”.

#196

No it was commited by British Extremsts.

edited to change britain to british.

#197

I am presuming that these are questions? but Im not entirely sure

[quote=“IRONMAN”]OK So there has not been a pouring of Mulsim terrorists into Iraq from other countries since Iraq 2 began.[b]

  • There has been the arrival of various nationalist muslim extremists, angered by the presence of the US yes, the fact that they are muslim is secondary. Disliking the US is not purely a matter of religion (Korea has managed to dislike you for entirely Areligious reasons)
    Wouldnt the arrival of people there, going out of their way specifically to fight you suggest that we are losing?[/b]

There are no more Muslim terrorists in the world than terrorists of other religions. - Non militant Muslims are more common than extremists, but no less devout in their religion.

The bombings in Britain recently were commited by Laplander extremists.

  • They were carried out by disaffected youth recruited by powerful people within the society. They were primarily blinded by their masters and brainwashed before anything else.

The twin towers on 9-11 were brought down by pissed off Kinkos employees. - Bought down by two aeroplanes hijacked by 4 individual men, (not a religion as a whole) They were from Arabic states but were primarily angerted by teh heavy presence of the US in their religous holy land. I can be annoyed at the presence of Gypos on our local sports field not because I am a devoted footballer but because its not their place to be!

And the Quran states that Christians are to be respected and befriended. - You do not know enough about the Koran, to draw conclusions from a few verses you found on google - until any of us are more informed it would be wise not to label an entire relgion as hateful spiteful or narrow minded and insular. Lest we get involved with Moronism and Jehovah’s Witnesses.

#198

Bullhockey. So you think most of the terrorism in the world comes from places other than the Middle East? Come on. You’re spouting trash again. You know better but say that anyway? What is wrong with you?

Do you really think that most of the terrorism in the world is perpetrated by non-Muslims? I’d like to hear you answer that one.

Pardon? 26 dead children what??? You’re talking out of your azz. Who said most of the Muslims in the world are evil? Show me where I said that.

Try once more to comprehend what I said:

  1. Most of the terrorism in the world comes from the Middle East.

  2. As long as there are people willing to act on some of the words of the Quoran there will be terrorists in the Middle East.

Try proving those statements wrong instead of insinuating that Americans glibly kill children. You should be very ashamed of yourself for sayting such a thing as that. Shame on you. Leave such trash out of here. But do try dispoving those two points, then apologize for saying such a filthy thing about Americans.

#199

No. You can’t.[/quote]

A friend sent me this recently, assuming, rightly, that I would find it amusing.
Having read some of Ironman’s posts, I’m now less sure of the humour.

Recently, Dr. Laura Schlessinger said on her radio show that
homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned
in any circumstance.
The following is an open letter penned by a listener and posted on the
Internet:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s Law. I
have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge
with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle,
for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination.
End of debate.
I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to
follow them.

a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord (Lev. 1:9).
The problem is my neighbours.
They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7.
In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

c) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are
purchased from neighbouring nations.
A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify?
Why can’t I own Canadians?

d) I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?

e) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser
abomination than homosexuality.
I don’t agree. Can you settle this?

f) Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit
that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

g) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is
expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27.
How should they die?

h) I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football
if I wear gloves?

i) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of
two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot.
Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16)
Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help.
Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is enduring and unchanging.
Your devoted disciple and adoring fan.

#200

Iron man wrote

'The Muslims hate everything about the west. They see us as infidels. They believe we are bidding against God. They believe that the west is the source of all of the evil and infidelity in the world. The believe that western society is corrupted, evil, and practices indirect idolatry. They dislike us also because we are allies of Israel.

Does this mean that it will never be possible to make them like us? Absofreakinglutely! As long as they are not Christian and the west predominantly is, it will be so. Does that mean that we cannot make friends with them and even allies of them? Perhaps for a while, but not permanently.

Are you completely blind to all of the world that is being conducted by Muslims against predominantly Christian peoples? Even in Chechnya, the bombings in schools which killed 200+ children were conducted by Muslims against Slavic Christians. Sometimes it is politically motivated, other times it is plainly religious. But the basis of it all is religion.

You have much to learn about the Muslim people.

EDITED TO ADD:

The Saudis are already taking up the cause. They are fighting terroist with a huge, highly sophisticated intelligence network in theor own country. I saw a documentary recently which showed the insides of their new terrorist operations facilities. There were gigantic plasma screen monitors all over the place. It is a good start.’

You have now shown yourself for the racist that you are my friend. All Muslims are to be hated! As long as any Muslim lives th West is in danger.

Plasma screens stop terrorism.

Sheesh, what are you on!