Keep Serbia United Petition

Originally Posted by Drake

I regularly play cards with a friend of mine who happens to be a turkish muslim (theoretically at least, like I am theoretically protestant). The vast majority just live their lives and adopt and of course they influence the whole society to an extent. There are always losers of the society and we have to address the problem before it really becomes one, but it happens all along the way.

The facts about all these suicide bombers in the US, Spain, London testify that these people were quite successful in western societies, and no one described them as losers that were alianated from the rest.

Not really, no…

I think it has to do with close ethnic identification between Serbs and Ukrainians/Russians…

Unfortunately, it seemed to be almost to the point of enabling…

Who is that you are put back in power?Indians?
Did i miss something- may be there was an “Native American” president in USA ? Or at least one Indians-conrgessmen?:slight_smile:
What do you mean Nick?

I guess the point that you keep missing is that the Native Americans are no where a solid majority in the US except on their reservations, where they have their own indigenous laws and codes. And there are several congressmen that trace some ancestry to NAs…

And atrocities committed in the 1890s do not justify ones being committed in the 1990s…

But all the serbians ARE the criminals - sems this thought was inspired at you by the CNN?
If Serbs deserved its destiny - why the albanians should avoid WHAT THEY SOWED?
Just coz they are the Americans “friends” today? And coz you think the USA could ALWAYS controll them the Muslim state via the military power?Like the Pakistan or Iraq?
But where the GUARANTY of that?

And what gave the Serbs the right to ethnically cleanse not just Kosovo, but Bosnia-Herzegovina, and Croatia? And my opinions are not based solely in CNN or the BBC here as I was in the US Army at the time; though their coverage of massacres and the Serb’s inadvertent martyring of the whole city of Sarajevo and Muslims driving out of Kosovo on tractors was rather powerful imagery. So was the Serbs abduction of NATO soldiers and use of them as human shields. Once they began to act with such arrogance, it was only a matter of time…

The point about the US “controlling” a Muslim state is something I completely do not understand. The US does not control nor have anyone in Pakistan, and the Iraq gov’t, as bad as it is and for all its failings, is still one that was elected…

There are no doubt cultural and religious artifacts that need protecting…

Well let’s use the other way of thinking.
As we know many Ireland had immigrated into USA so does it mean they were oppressed people in Britain?:smiley:
And if they ware opressed coz some of them actually took part in IRA- Is it the real reason to separate the Notern Ireland from Britain?
Had your british gov agreed to separate the Britain during the 1970-80 when IRA actively fought with the Britis police and killed even the civiliance?

The Irish diaspora which fled mostly to the US and Britain to a lessor extent, was fleeing a famine after a fungus destroyed their potato crops for several years. The histories of oppression by the Irish are still no rationale for modern ethnic cleansing.

And again, you’re failing to recognize a fundamental distinction in that in Northern Ireland, the majority of the population is protestant under the Presbyterian and Anglican faiths and want to maintain a “union” with the UK. Although population demographics are incrementally shifting, presumably leading to a Catholic majority that will seek to unify with Éire one day…

The comparison is misleading since it would be more apt if the British Army was arming and backing Protestant militias and they were terrorizing the Irish forcing them out of their homes to the Irish Republic (Éire)…

No.
Besides the Britian even had sended the Army and fleet at the lillte Malvinas Island to protect it and SAVED it FOR Britain.
So do you really think that you Brits have right to protect YOUR land ( Even if the separatists like Ireland lived here from the ancient times) but the Serbs have NO RIGHT to protect their land fro?
This s a question…

Again, when did the Falkland Islanders vote to become Argentinians?

Yea Robin Hood was my favorite hero when was a kid.
As i remember he robbered the richs and defended the poorest.
But sorry Bravo - i doubt he did something simular like the Kosovars extremists ( i mean the ethnic cleaning and mass murdering of the Ortodoxy Christians)

So you want to say if the any criminals who has no access to power nevertheless HAS the right to steal the peace of Country where he was judged , and declare the independence?
And BTW the Russian “revolution” HAD the foreign sponsors

Funny, I thought is was Muslim Kosovars that were fleeing to Albania on tractors and were the victims of massacres…

He hE he folks.
While the Washingtin is too busy by the supportion of separatists in Serbia and China ( like and everywhere else) the American domestic separatists have declared the Independence:)
Indians seems want the OWN state inside of America:)
What is this - Merry Chiristmas Indians joike or beginning of the end of the America:)?
Your versions…

This is entire problem Drake:)
While thay are still 30% they are try to assimilate the YOUR culture and style of life - but there not need to be the super genius to conclude that by such great birth-rate and emigration rate they WILL soon the 60 or even 70% among YOUR community - the situation would be quite different.
Believe me , coz i.m to live in Nothern Caucaus where the society about 30-40% non-russian.
So when they have the majority they suddenly began to REALISE that they do not need MORE to assimulate- they simply began to absorb the native population and install the own rules.That sometimes are quite different of our moral standards:)
Sure i do not wish tell that all imigrants and muslims so bad.There a lot of excellent peoples( some of them are my good acquaintance mens)
But …the mosl likely scenario for the Europe if try nothing to change is the muslim immigration is inevitable pro-muslim transformation of society.
And among the any sociaty exists OWN extremists who ready to warm up the political situation to its personal profit.
So Kato is right.
We should care about our countries guyes , while we can:)

Well i/m not even mean the all Kosovars are criminals, but i want to show that to steal a part of YOUR state by the good people is though a bad idea…)For all of us.And forgive me to if something was wrong…
So why the Serbs should be worst them we are?

But they still have the limitation of civil right in USA, right?
And the American gov HAD never LET them to separate and creat the own INDIAN states , am i wrong?

And what gave the Serbs the right to ethnically cleanse not just Kosovo, but Bosnia-Herzegovina, and Croatia? And my opinions are not based solely in CNN or the BBC here as I was in the US Army at the time; though their coverage of massacres and the Serb’s inadvertent martyring of the whole city of Sarajevo and Muslims driving out of Kosovo on tractors was rather powerful imagery. So was the Serbs abduction of NATO soldiers and use of them as human shields. Once they began to act with such arrogance, it was only a matter of time…

Do you know why i KNOW that you watch JUST CNN and BBC - it simply - coz YOU NOTHING know about the mass murdering of Serian civilils , ethnical cleansing of Ortodoxy peoples and cutting off the hears of hostages.
The entire problem YOUR nick is the One-side biased anti-serbs point that was inspired by the mass media.
I/m far from to defend the Serbs military criminals - they all were judged and sentenced ( some of them got 20-30 years).
But that problem of Fu,g justice - thay do not WISH to notice the violence above the Sers siviliance.
They demonstrate the column of Kosovars tractors- but they do not show the ethnical cleansing of Serbs by muslims.
They do not wish to admite tha FACT that the Muslims terrorist in Srebrenica USED the Dutch peicemakers as a “cover” agains the serbs.They calmly slaughtered the Serbs villiages aroung the city and then hided under “UN defence”.
The Muslim War criminals still are no punished - may be this is OK for you but we , slavs, could not watch to it calmly.

The point about the US “controlling” a Muslim state is something I completely do not understand. The US does not control nor have anyone in Pakistan,…

Oh just do not play a naive man…do not understand :slight_smile:
Really you do not understand as the USA support the some of regimes and dictarorships via the military and finantial support in aim to prevent the comming to the power the radical elements in those states:)
Kinda in Pakistan and Afganistan today .
I do not tell about Mexica and Southern America …where a lot of “democratic regimes” were sponsored by … we both know whom:)
Is this not a kinf of way of external controll those state?

Sure you though so:)
What could think the man who never saw the other side of propoganda:)
And did you interest about the fate ot the people in Serbs anklavs of Kosovo?No?
So i could tell you that all of them lives today in FEAR of pogroms or be murder.
Last anti-serbs pogrom was in 2004. The Albanians attacked EVEN the UN forces who tryed to stop the violence.
This is very GOOD instance of the what might be in future here:)

Actually I already posted on this issue but it is no more on the forum so I’ll do it again.

Freedom! Lakota Sioux Indians Declare Sovereign Nation Status

Threaten Land Liens, Contested Real Estate Over Five State Area in U.S. West

Lakota Satisfies Treaty Council Mandate of 33 Years, Drafted by 97 Indigenous Nations

Dakota Territory Reverts back to Lakota Control According to U.S., International Law

Washington D.C. – Lakota Sioux Indian representatives declared sovereign nation status today in Washington D.C. following Monday’s withdrawal from all previously signed treaties with the United States Government. The withdrawal, hand delivered to Daniel Turner, Deputy Director of Public Liaison at the State Department, immediately and irrevocably ends all agreements between the Lakota Sioux Nation of Indians and the United States Government outlined in the 1851 and 1868 Treaties at Fort Laramie Wyoming.

“This is an historic day for our Lakota people,” declared Russell Means, Itacan of Lakota. “United States colonial rule is at its end!”

“Today is a historic day and our forefathers speak through us. Our Forefathers made the treaties in good faith with the sacred Canupa and with the knowledge of the Great Spirit,” shared Garry Rowland from Wounded Knee. “They never honored the treaties, that’s the reason we are here today.”

The four member Lakota delegation traveled to Washington D.C. culminating years of internal discussion among treaty representatives of the various Lakota communities. Delegation members included well known activist and actor Russell Means, Women of All Red Nations (WARN) founder Phyllis Young, Oglala Lakota Strong Heart Society leader Duane Martin Sr., and Garry Rowland, Leader Chief Big Foot Riders. Means, Rowland, Martin Sr. were all members of the 1973 Wounded Knee takeover.

“In order to stop the continuous taking of our resources – people, land, water and children- we have no choice but to claim our own destiny,” said Phyllis Young, a former Indigenous representative to the United Nations and representative from Standing Rock.

Property ownership in the five state area of Lakota now takes center stage. Parts of North and South Dakota, Nebraska, Wyoming and Montana have been illegally homesteaded for years despite knowledge of Lakota as predecessor sovereign [historic owner]. Lakota representatives say if the United States does not enter into immediate diplomatic negotiations, liens will be filed on real estate transactions in the five state region, clouding title over literally thousands of square miles of land and property.

Young added, “The actions of Lakota are not intended to embarrass the United States but to simply save the lives of our people”.

Following Monday’s withdrawal at the State Department, the four Lakota Itacan representatives have been meeting with foreign embassy officials in order to hasten their official return to the Family of Nations.

Lakota’s efforts are gaining traction as Bolivia, home to Indigenous President Evo Morales, shared they are “very, very interested in the Lakota case” while Venezuela received the Lakota delegation with “respect and solidarity.”

“Our meetings have been fruitful and we hope to work with these countries for better relations,” explained Garry Rowland. “As a nation, we have equal status within the national community.”

Education, energy and justice now take top priority in emerging Lakota. “Cultural immersion education is crucial as a next step to protect our language, culture and sovereignty,” said Means. “Energy independence using solar, wind, geothermal, and sugar beets enables Lakota to protect our freedom and provide electricity and heating to our people.”

The Lakota reservations are among the most impoverished areas in North America, a shameful legacy of broken treaties and apartheid policies. Lakota has the highest death rate in the United States and Lakota men have the lowest life expectancy of any nation on earth, excluding AIDS, at approximately 44 years. Lakota infant mortality rate is five times the United States average and teen suicide rates 150% more than national average . 97% of Lakota people live below the poverty line and unemployment hovers near 85%.

“After 150 years of colonial enforcement, when you back people into a corner there is only one alternative,” emphasized Duane Martin Sr. “The only alternative is to bring freedom into its existence by taking it back to the love of freedom, to our lifeway.”

We are the freedom loving Lakota from the Sioux Indian reservations of Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota and Montana who have suffered from cultural and physical genocide in the colonial apartheid system we have been forced to live under. We are in Washington DC to withdraw from the constitutionally mandated treaties to become a free and independent country. We are alerting the Family of Nations we have now reassumed our freedom and independence with the backing of Natural, International, and United States law. For more information, please visit our new website at www.lakotafreedom.com.

Supporting separatists in China?

But the majority of them want to live in another state…After being largely ethnically cleansed and almost totally expelled to Albania, I can’t say I blame them…

No. They actually have more rights in some cases. In fact political fights have taken place over their right to not pay federal or New York state taxes on gasoline and tobacco sales. In fact, about ten years ago, they closed the NY “Thruway,” (Route 90) which is a major motorway through the northern half of the USA.

They got their way, and now operate largely profitable casinos. Of course, the Senecas (the major tribe in NYS) have their own problems of extreme wealth disparity as they have a small percentage controlling vast amounts of money, and the majority living a working class existence.

Do you know why i KNOW that you watch JUST CNN and BBC - it simply - coz YOU NOTHING know about the mass murdering of Serian civilils , ethnical cleansing of Ortodoxy peoples and cutting off the hears of hostages.

Actually, they showed a story on CNN where Bosnian infantry murdered old Serbian women by cutting their throats.

But, the Serbs massacred large numbers of people wholesale, and virtually began the War before the Croats or Bosnians knew what was happening…

Maybe it was you that didn’t really know what was going on?

The entire problem YOUR nick is the One-side biased anti-serbs point that was inspired by the mass media.

LOL The numbers speak for themselves…

The thing is, you seem to think one Serb life is greater and worth more than dozens of Bosnian, Croat, and Kosovar lives. The fact is that the Serb militia/terror groups had the armor, artillery, and air power while the KLA had nothing but small arms and the Bosnians and Croats did not acquire heavy weapons until late in the conflicts (which is what essentially ended it after NATO air strikes).

I/m far from to defend the Serbs military criminals - they all were judged and sentenced ( some of them got 20-30 years).
But that problem of Fu,g justice - thay do not WISH to notice the violence above the Sers siviliance.
They demonstrate the column of Kosovars tractors- but they do not show the ethnical cleansing of Serbs by muslims.

Oh, I suppose CNN and BBC were allowed to accompany Serbian police and military units, right?

They do not wish to admite tha FACT that the Muslims terrorist in Srebrenica USED the Dutch peicemakers as a “cover” agains the serbs.They calmly slaughtered the Serbs villiages aroung the city and then hided under “UN defence”.
The Muslim War criminals still are no punished - may be this is OK for you but we , slavs, could not watch to it calmly.

Sheer fantasy. Revisionist shit calculated to counter the recent video showing and proving one of Europe’s largest massacres took place despite long Serbian denials…

Oh just do not play a naive man…do not understand :slight_smile:
Really you do not understand as the USA support the some of regimes and dictarorships via the military and finantial support in aim to prevent the comming to the power the radical elements in those states:)
Kinda in Pakistan and Afganistan today .
I do not tell about Mexica and Southern America …where a lot of “democratic regimes” were sponsored by … we both know whom:)
Is this not a kinf of way of external controll those state?

Now we’re just off topic. I’ve never defended the US support of various regimes. But Musharraf didn’t ask US permission when he toppled the Pakistani gov’t in a coup, and it was condemned.

And the “mayor of Kabul,” Karzai is democratically elected.

Much like Russia’s friends running Chechnya…

They already have their state Albania. When Albanians were allowed to move from Albania ( the poorest state in Europe ) to comparatively well-to-do Serbia, they voluntary got subject to the laws of Serbia, and these laws treat their capture of Serbian territory (possible only due to the US assistane) as a crime. So Albanians violated their obligations which they voluntary taken, violated laws and therefore they are criminals as well as the US bereaucrats and others who supported them.

Kato, this isn’t going to become a pissing match and mirror for every site out there that you thinks supports your point of view…

If you continue to spam the forums with off-topic agenda pieces, we’re going to have a problem…

P.S.: The Lakota are not succeeding, they are applying for “sovereign nation” status, since they are already autonomous of the US gov’t…

LOL No, the ethnic Albanian-Muslims have been in Kosovo since the Ottomans controlled the area.

Maybe present day Turkey has a claim according to your logic?

Turkey could have a claim according to my logic, if Serbs had voluntary gave Kosovo to the Ottoman Empire.

P.S.: The Lakota are not succeeding, they are applying for “sovereign nation” status, since they are already autonomous of the US gov’t…

Quite correct they are already autonomous and claim the full sovereignty and independence. So the US is to accept their separation and US troops should kill anyone who is against free Lakota according to the US logic in Kosovo

Now we’re way off topic. Firstly, it’s not the “US” position on anything, it’s under the UN/international community…

And now you’re just spamming this thread with ridiculous analogies…

Closing until further notice…

I’m unlocking this in hopes it doesn’t become a flame fest of nationalist bashing…

I know exactly what you mean. Some of us are still pissed off with William (The Bastard) of Normandy.

http://www.battle-of-hastings-1066.org.uk/biography-william-the-conqueror.htm

We live in very turbulant times, my friend.

Benazir Bhutto assassinated
Pakistan’s former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto is killed in a suicide attack at an election rally in the garrison city of Rawalpindi.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/default.stm