ODDESA The Organization of Former SS-Members (emigrated)

[South_African_Milita]

@BDL

[quote=Erwin Schätzer(argentina)]hey,why don´t you think of the fighter SS’s?,the fought too!,more than the tortures they commit,and the waffen ss,don´t tortured,they we´re combat units (an elite,the best).

The SS were mass murdering scum. I can repsect what they achieved in battle, but they all deserve a slow painful death.[/quote]

And I also agree.

Erwin, even if there were a few guys who did not participate in the killings that other SS guys did, that still does not make it right to say its all right for them to escape punishment. The SS obviously beleived in what Hitler did was right, and that Nazism was right, and Im sure that anybody in the SS wouldve heard of at least some of the mass murders that the SS had done, and therefore if there was some decency in them, they wouldve known that it was all wrong.

So do you agree with Nazism? If not then I do not think you should be proud of what your country did.

[Sturmtruppen]

@South_African_Milita

[quote=BDL][quote=Erwin Schätzer(argentina)]hey,why don´t you think of the fighter SS’s?,the fought too!,more than the tortures they commit,and the waffen ss,don´t tortured,they we´re combat units (an elite,the best).

The SS were mass murdering scum. I can repsect what they achieved in battle, but they all deserve a slow painful death.[/quote]

And I also agree.

Erwin, even if there were a few guys who did not participate in the killings that other SS guys did, that still does not make it right to say its all right for them to escape punishment. The SS obviously beleived in what Hitler did was right, and that Nazism was right, and Im sure that anybody in the SS wouldve heard of at least some of the mass murders that the SS had done, and therefore if there was some decency in them, they wouldve known that it was all wrong.

So do you agree with Nazism? If not then I do not think you should be proud of what your country did.[/quote]
Im NOT AGREE WITH NAZISM,sam,you can´t ban me only because i like a troop that you and most of member hate.
I like them,because of their fights in their army.They were an elite.
THEY WERE CULT AND INTELLIGENT PEOPLE,that´s why i like them.

@Firefly

Not a good argument, you need to expand, you could have been trained by any military, and the actual amount of Nazis was surely not enough to greatly increase the population. All it does is make your country, and a lot of other S American countries look bad.

If they look bad is because they are lazy,and they don´t work or have a high demographic rate with their low amount of monet per head.
you have to see the countries we have limits with in our left and up us.they´re disasters.the only sucesfull countries in sa are argentina and brasil,sad,but they true.

and any military isn´t the same as experienced soldiers of an elite of GERMANY!.

[Firefly]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

[quote=South African Military][quote=BDL][quote=Erwin Schätzer(argentina)]hey,why don´t you think of the fighter SS’s?,the fought too!,more than the tortures they commit,and the waffen ss,don´t tortured,they we´re combat units (an elite,the best).

The SS were mass murdering scum. I can repsect what they achieved in battle, but they all deserve a slow painful death.[/quote]

And I also agree.

Erwin, even if there were a few guys who did not participate in the killings that other SS guys did, that still does not make it right to say its all right for them to escape punishment. The SS obviously beleived in what Hitler did was right, and that Nazism was right, and Im sure that anybody in the SS wouldve heard of at least some of the mass murders that the SS had done, and therefore if there was some decency in them, they wouldve known that it was all wrong.

So do you agree with Nazism? If not then I do not think you should be proud of what your country did.[/quote]
Im NOT AGREE WITH NAZISM,sam,you can´t ban me only because i like a troop that you and most of member hate.
I like them,because of their fights in their army.They were an elite.
THEY WERE CULT AND INTELLIGENT PEOPLE,that´s why i like them.

@Firefly

Not a good argument, you need to expand, you could have been trained by any military, and the actual amount of Nazis was surely not enough to greatly increase the population. All it does is make your country, and a lot of other S American countries look bad.

If they look bad is because they are lazy,and they don´t work or have a high demographic rate with their low amount of monet per head.
you have to see the countries we have limits with in our left and up us.they´re disasters.the only sucesfull countries in sa are argentina and brasil,sad,but they true.

and any military isn´t the same as experienced soldiers of an elite of GERMANY!.[/quote]

So what good were these experience soldiers of those elite? Did they actually have a benefit for shaming your country so much in the eyes of the rest of the world.

[Sturmtruppen]

I dk if they did or not better the image of my country,but,it´s a shit of important for me.

i want a great country,no the others to think that.

I dk their experience,im not waffen-ss.

but the germans who come here formed part of the army,the half part of the army and officers were germans,if you see the argentinian military topic you will see.

we allowed them to use their nazi uniforms,because they were like the argentinian uniform,but with the swastica.

And i think all the propaganda,makes you forget the work of the german soldiers,they haven´t a nice life.

[Cuts]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

we don´t know what did himmler ordered to his soldiers,maybe they were obligated,and hitler hated so much the jews,so,the waffen-ss could have that work because hitler wanted.

But Erwin, we do know what Himmler ordered his troops to do, the efficient German archivists ensured that there was more than enough evidence available to show the guilty parties for what they were.

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

and if you say,why did the join the waffen SS?:the uniforms are cool (better for the morale),they are special trained troops (that means,they are better than regular troops),and they were the last troops on foot and doing resistance when the allies were finishing germany.

You nucking futter ! There’s nobody on the planet who makes the decision to join the forces based on the ‘coolness’ of a uniform ! :lol:
Prior to the outbreak of hostilities and at the start of the war the SS had extremely high requirements as to racial purity, even rejecting those who had a filled tooth, but as time went on their standards dropped and they were conscripting men and boys in.
There’s no ‘elite’ unit anywhere that uses conscription to fill it’s ranks.

There were SS catering units - were these “special trained troops” [sic] ?
Yes if you consider the cook’s cse to be specialist trg, but it does not make them ‘elite’ by any definition.

As to the Waffen SS not being involved in any KZ murders… :roll:
There was a good deal of transfer between the Waffen and Allgemeine branches, and one could transfer from one to the other with relative ease.

If you want to talk about spec trg, try the troops that flew in on Gran Sasso in the Abruzzi Apennines.
Those blokes were SS and abn/cdo trained, but they were in the minority.
(They may or may not have been involved in atrocities prior to their selection for this particular op, but on an individual basis rather than as a unit.)

[Sturmtruppen]

[quote=“Cuts”]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

we don´t know what did himmler ordered to his soldiers,maybe they were obligated,and hitler hated so much the jews,so,the waffen-ss could have that work because hitler wanted.

But Erwin, we do know what Himmler ordered his troops to do, the efficient German archivists ensured that there was more than enough evidence available to show the guilty parties for what they were.

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

and if you say,why did the join the waffen SS?:the uniforms are cool (better for the morale),they are special trained troops (that means,they are better than regular troops),and they were the last troops on foot and doing resistance when the allies were finishing germany.

You nucking futter ! There’s nobody on the planet who makes the decision to join the forces based on the ‘coolness’ of a uniform ! :lol:
Prior to the outbreak of hostilities and at the start of the war the SS had extremely high requirements as to racial purity, even rejecting those who had a filled tooth, but as time went on their standards dropped and they were conscripting men and boys in.
There’s no ‘elite’ unit anywhere that uses conscription to fill it’s ranks.

There were SS catering units - were these “special trained troops” [sic] ?
Yes if you consider the cook’s cse to be specialist trg, but it does not make them ‘elite’ by any definition.

As to the Waffen SS not being involved in any KZ murders… :roll:
There was a good deal of transfer between the Waffen and Allgemeine branches, and one could transfer from one to the other with relative ease.

If you want to talk about spec trg, try the troops that flew in on Gran Sasso in the Abruzzi Apennines.
Those blokes were SS and abn/cdo trained, but they were in the minority.
(They may or may not have been involved in atrocities prior to their selection for this particular op, but on an individual basis rather than as a unit.)[/quote]

well,i know about the uniform,fun reply :lol: .Maybe the requeriments of racial purity increased the morale of them,because when you had racial purity in nazi germany,you were superior (that what they thought).

Of course they trainment was especial,they were trained like templars!,the templars were the greatest soldiers in their years.
and they had a high culture and IC (intellectual coefficient)

only a minority was involved in tortures (there are actually tortures and nobody says nothing!)

they needed finally the conscription of younger members because the TRAINMENT WAS TOO MUCH HARD for the soldiers,and they were a small quantity,and by making lower the difficult to increase to the waffen-ss,he recruited more people with lower requeriments.

[BDL]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

well,i know about the uniform,fun reply :lol: .Maybe the requeriments of racial purity increased the morale of them,because when you had racial purity in nazi germany,you were superior (that what they thought).

Of course they trainment was especial,they were trained like templars!,the templars were the greatest soldiers in their years.
and they had a high culture and IC (intellectual coefficient)

only a minority was involved in tortures (there are actually tortures and nobody says nothing!)

they needed finally the conscription of younger members because the TRAINMENT WAS TOO MUCH HARD for the soldiers,and they were a small quantity,and by making lower the difficult to increase to the waffen-ss,he recruited more people with lower requeriments.

Erwin, it was certainly not a minority that was involved in torture and murder, it was an overwhelming majority. There are many documented cases of SS men who refused to get involved being transferred to the Whermacht for lacking in the SS spirit.

As Cuts, there were certainly many SS men who were not the highly trained supermen they are often made out to be. I can respect their fighting abilities because they were undoubtedly very good soldiers (in some of the SS Divisions like Totenkopf and Das Reich), however many of the later war Divisions (some of them made up of the same “untermensch” that they had been happy enough to torture and kill a few years earlier - Bosnian and Armenian Muslims for example) were extremely poor.

As I said before, good soldiers but extremely poor human beings.

[Sturmtruppen]

@BDL

Erwin, it was certainly not a minority that was involved in torture and murder, it was an overwhelming majority. There are many documented cases of SS men who refused to get involved being transferred to the Whermacht for lacking in the SS spirit.

As Cuts, there were certainly many SS men who were not the highly trained supermen they are often made out to be. I can respect their fighting abilities because they were undoubtedly very good soldiers (in some of the SS Divisions like Totenkopf and Das Reich), however many of the later war Divisions (some of them made up of the same “untermensch” that they had been happy enough to torture and kill a few years earlier - Bosnian and Armenian Muslims for example) were extremely poor.

As I said before, good soldiers but extremely poor human beings.

yes,but,a nazi soldier wans´t for having human sentiments,they were for killing,that maked a soldier a good soldier (the human sentiments).

And,i said the minority of the waffen-SS,not of the SS.

[Cuts]

Erwin, reference your claim that the Waffen-SS received special (harder ?) training than the Wehrmacht, may I point you to another chap who’s quite fond of the SS and appears to be well read in their history:

@Hosenfield

Regular Waffen-SS training was the same as army training. Except for the fact that they received lectures 3 times a week on nazism. Which doesn’t mean they would , as if on autopilot, comit warcrimes as norm.

http://www.ww2incolor.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=177&start=180

[Firefly]

This is beginning to sound like the other thread now.

Erwin, why did they make your country better?

Please explain it, fascism ruined your country. In the 1900’s Argentina was on of the richer of the worlds countries, so what happened.

Id say they helped ruin it.

[Sturmtruppen]

@Firefly

This is beginning to sound like the other thread now.

Erwin, why did they make your country better?

Please explain it, fascism ruined your country. In the 1930’s Argentina was on of the richer of the worlds countries, so what happened.

Id say they helped ruin it.

Firefly: No,the bad governments,both democratics and dictatorships,without the nation support fucked argentina.
The fascism?,the people was fascist,the dictatorships were pro-american.
galtieri did the fk war because he thought he will crush england with the help of usa,but,usa didn´t help,they helped uk,so…LOST WAR.

Cuts,i dk where did you get that,but,i readed the trainment of the waffen-ss,5 years ago,im going to search it.

[BDL]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

yes,but,a nazi soldier wans´t for having human sentiments,they were for killing,that maked a soldier a good soldier (the human sentiments).

And,i said the minority of the waffen-SS,not of the SS.

But the British soldier of today is almost certainly the best trained soldier in the world, and they don’t feel the need to execute civillians or gas people for being the wrong religion.

It was not a minority of the Waffen SS, most of them can be implicated in war crimes, from Heinrich Himmler down to the lowliest SS-Mann. They were overwhelmingly war criminals who deserved to be punished, unfortunately I believe very few of them were. They were a product of what was at the time a sick nation with a sick regime, and they certainly would not have considered what they did wrong, but that does not absolve them from basic human decency.

[Sturmtruppen]

[quote=“BDL”]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

yes,but,a nazi soldier wans´t for having human sentiments,they were for killing,that maked a soldier a good soldier (the human sentiments).

And,i said the minority of the waffen-SS,not of the SS.

But the British soldier of today is almost certainly the best trained soldier in the world, and they don’t feel the need to execute civillians or gas people for being the wrong religion.

It was not a minority of the Waffen SS, most of them can be implicated in war crimes, from Heinrich Himmler down to the lowliest SS-Mann. They were overwhelmingly war criminals who deserved to be punished, unfortunately I believe very few of them were. They were a product of what was at the time a sick nation with a sick regime, and they certainly would not have considered what they did wrong, but that does not absolve them from basic human decency.[/quote]

the most trained??? :lol: ,the american soldiers are the most trained!,of course.
I dk actually,but the french were always great,the normands dominated england.The french are great troops.

And what about the germans?,i dk today,but they have war in their veins.

Im agree with you,the nazis are all sick,fucked brains,but as hoosefield said,not all of them were of the nazi party.
No all of them tortured.
=i like those who don´t tortured.

why nobody wants me to like them?,what´s the problem if i like them?,i don´t like the nazism,i like the troops.

[Firefly]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

[quote=BDL][quote=Erwin Schätzer(argentina)]
yes,but,a nazi soldier wans´t for having human sentiments,they were for killing,that maked a soldier a good soldier (the human sentiments).

And,i said the minority of the waffen-SS,not of the SS.

But the British soldier of today is almost certainly the best trained soldier in the world, and they don’t feel the need to execute civillians or gas people for being the wrong religion.

It was not a minority of the Waffen SS, most of them can be implicated in war crimes, from Heinrich Himmler down to the lowliest SS-Mann. They were overwhelmingly war criminals who deserved to be punished, unfortunately I believe very few of them were. They were a product of what was at the time a sick nation with a sick regime, and they certainly would not have considered what they did wrong, but that does not absolve them from basic human decency.[/quote]

the most trained??? :lol: ,the american soldiers are the most trained!,of course.
I dk actually,but the french were always great,the normands dominated england.The french are great troops.

And what about the germans?,i dk today,but they have war in their veins.

Im agree with you,the nazis are all sick,fucked brains,but as hoosefield said,not all of them were of the nazi party.
No all of them tortured.
=i like those who don´t tortured.

why nobody wants me to like them?,what´s the problem if i like them?,i don´t like the nazism,i like the troops.[/quote]

Well unfortunately your Agument dies there becuase the majority of those that DID torture who escaped Europe ended up living in S America.

[BDL]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

the most trained??? :lol: ,the american soldiers are the most trained!,of course.
I dk actually,but the french were always great,the normands dominated england.The french are great troops.

And what about the germans?,i dk today,but they have war in their veins.

That first line is, of course, a joke I assume? It’s also been a long long time since the French were great soldiers, and the Normans were Vikings that had settled in northern France, not French. I think that the Germans have got rid of the “war in their blood” nowadays, I think that rebuilding every street in every city in their country made them realise that modern war wasn’t a very good idea.

As for the SS - I’ve tried to make you see, I give up and leave it to someone with more patience

[Firefly]

Well Im at the end of my SS patience as well, I now have 2 guys who think theres nothing wrong with belonging to an organisation thats sole purpose was racial extermination and the enslavement of other cultures. All they see is that Big King Tiger, christ it wasnt even that a great tank!

[Sturmtruppen]

[quote=“BDL”]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

the most trained??? :lol: ,the american soldiers are the most trained!,of course.
I dk actually,but the french were always great,the normands dominated england.The french are great troops.

And what about the germans?,i dk today,but they have war in their veins.

That first line is, of course, a joke I assume? It’s also been a long long time since the French were great soldiers, and the Normans were Vikings that had settled in northern France, not French. I think that the Germans have got rid of the “war in their blood” nowadays, I think that rebuilding every street in every city in their country made them realise that modern war wasn’t a very good idea.

As for the SS - I’ve tried to make you see, I give up and leave it to someone with more patience[/quote]
The first line isn´t a joke.
USA has everything in military,better than anybody in this days.

The frenchs are great,and if you put the stupid question,of ,why germany ocuppied frenchs?.easy:because they thought like germans,they were fascists.Germany is destacated for their great army.I don´t think the uk army is one of the best,they´re just better than a non activity army (yes,the argentina army wasn´t much in activity since 1982 and the peace missions).homewever.UK has a great technology and nukes,and they´re friends of usa.
make me see?,im afraid you aren´t my father,and you aren´t older than me (im 21).
And i think you´re taking privileges because im moderator,but i will never use my mod powers for a personal confrontation/debate/argument.

And sorry roast beef,you´re not going to change my oppinion.

[Sturmtruppen]

@Firefly

Well Im at the end of my SS patience as well, I now have 2 guys who think theres nothing wrong with belonging to an organisation thats sole purpose was racial extermination and the enslavement of other cultures. All they see is that Big King Tiger, christ it wasnt even that a great tank!

And i have two guys who think they owned the truth.Im afraid you don´t know all about the ss (me too) and you don´t know a shit about my country,so,think before talking about it.
we aren´t a host for killers.And im afraid other countries are killing innocent civilians…

Christ wasn´t a tank,your avatar is a tank!

[Firefly]

@Erwin Schätzer(argentina)

[quote=Firefly]Well Im at the end of my SS patience as well, I now have 2 guys who think theres nothing wrong with belonging to an organisation thats sole purpose was racial extermination and the enslavement of other cultures. All they see is that Big King Tiger, christ it wasnt even that a great tank!

And i have two guys who think they owned the truth.Im afraid you don´t know all about the ss (me too) and you don´t know a shit about my country,so,think before talking about it.
we aren´t a host for killers.And im afraid other countries are killing innocent civilians…

Christ wasn´t a tank,your avatar is a tank![/quote]

You were a host for killers, how about Joseph Mengele, defend your countries decision to let him stay there. And I believe I know more about your country than you do about mine. Also I dont understand the Tank bit I think it is lost in translation. Also Also - please calm down and have a rational discussion.

[Sturmtruppen]

@Firefly

[quote=Erwin Schätzer(argentina)][quote=Firefly]Well Im at the end of my SS patience as well, I now have 2 guys who think theres nothing wrong with belonging to an organisation thats sole purpose was racial extermination and the enslavement of other cultures. All they see is that Big King Tiger, christ it wasnt even that a great tank!

And i have two guys who think they owned the truth.Im afraid you don´t know all about the ss (me too) and you don´t know a shit about my country,so,think before talking about it.
we aren´t a host for killers.And im afraid other countries are killing innocent civilians…

Christ wasn´t a tank,your avatar is a tank![/quote]

You were a host for killers, how about Joseph Mengele, defend your countries decision to let him stay there. And I believe I know more about your country than you do about mine. Also I dont understand the Tank bit I think it is lost in translation. Also Also - please calm down and have a rational discussion.[/quote]
I calm down,if you don´t simulate to being the owners of thrut,insult my country (im not going to able you to do that).
And my country isn´t a host of terrorists like other country!.
ok,i will calm down if you don´t use your cheap sarcasm.

fiinished/done