Use of tracer in BREN guns

[Man_of_Stoat]

@Walther

I just timed myself loading a .303 Bren magazine with loose blanks. It takes me about one minute.
You don’t need laoder for .303 Bren mags, but for the Sten you’ll definitely need one. The magazine spring is so stiff and the friction on the magazine walls is so big that you will only get about ten rounds in by hand.

Jan

And did you put any in wrong???

[Walther]

@Man_of_Stoat

[quote=Walther]I just timed myself loading a .303 Bren magazine with loose blanks. It takes me about one minute.
You don’t need laoder for .303 Bren mags, but for the Sten you’ll definitely need one. The magazine spring is so stiff and the friction on the magazine walls is so big that you will only get about ten rounds in by hand.

Jan

And did you put any in wrong??? ;)[/quote]
No, I got them all (28 rounds) in correctly, at first try

Jan

[Man_of_Stoat]

@Walther

No, I got them all (28 rounds) in correctly, at first try

Jan

Wow! Does this mean that “sherro” from Australia is wrong about it being a “curse”, just like he’s wrong about the calibres of the Chinese Mauser pistols? (they were 7.63 and .45ACP, fyi - SAOTW doesn’t mention any Chinese use of the 9mm ones).

Off topic: I spoke German on the phone “in anger” for the 1st time in ages this evening - booking a Ferienwohnung in Switzerland And I didn’t lapse into Dutch, although I will admit to using a colloquialism due to it being close to Dutch (beinah, cf. bijna)

[2nd_of_foot]

@Walther

I just timed myself loading a .303 Bren magazine with loose blanks. It takes me about one minute.
You don’t need loader for .303 Bren mags, but for the Sten you’ll definitely need one. The magazine spring is so stiff and the friction on the magazine walls is so big that you will only get about ten rounds in by hand.

Jan

Edit for typo

can not remember the correct time but at a minute you would have failed :lol:

[reiver]

As a non-military type, as I’ve read this debate, one question in particular keeps occuring to me, for which I would be grateful for an answer.
Ironman wrote :

The BAR could also fire tracer, armour piercing, and incendiary rounds, which were unsuitable in the Bren because of it’s curved magazine.

Could someone, preferably Ironman, since he seems to be the only one making this assertion, please advise me as to the difference between tracer/armour piercing/incendiary rounds, and normal ball ammo, which might make them unsuitable for use in a curved magazine?
From the photgraphs posted of them, they all look externally identical to me.

[Walther]

@2nd_of_foot

[quote=Walther]I just timed myself loading a .303 Bren magazine with loose blanks. It takes me about one minute.
You don’t need loader for .303 Bren mags, but for the Sten you’ll definitely need one. The magazine spring is so stiff and the friction on the magazine walls is so big that you will only get about ten rounds in by hand.

Jan

Edit for typo

can not remember the correct time but at a minute you would have failed :lol:[/quote]
Yeah, but I was limited by the number of rounds I can hold in each hand.

Jan

[Fuchs66]

@Walther

Yeah, but I was limited by the number of rounds I can hold in each hand.

Jan

The trick for the test is to have as many as possible in your hand with the bases of the rounds facing away from you and the rest lined up on the floor to your right hand side (if you’re right handed) also with the bases facing away from you. Then lots of quick thumb work. :lol:

[Walther]

Thanks for the tip! 45 seconds now!

:lol:

Jan

[Fuchs66]

@Walther

Thanks for the tip! 45 seconds now!

:lol:

Jan

See it works :lol:

That was going back a long time to my ACF years ooooooo about 25 years ago :lol: We had to complete the mag loading test as part of our SAA tests for IIRC our 3 Star qualification.

[King_Nothing]

http://img278.imageshack.us/img278/4521/3032gs.jpg

Just if anyone’s interested.

[system]

Thanks for that very interesting - Whilst I dont doubt its legitimiacy other users of this forum have previously “drawn” their own conclusions.

Have you got a reference for that diagram?

[King_Nothing]

Just got it from this site:

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/stephen.johnson/arms/

[system]

Thank you kindly.

[arhob1]

Some interesteing quotes in your first post Man of Stoat - thanks.

A few questions though:

1 - What did SMLE mean when he said “Of course, everyone knows you can’t use it past 300 metres…”? Does he mean that the tracer burns out after this range? Is this a typical range for tracer (the burn not the round of course)?
2 - The bren gun looks very heavy to me - how practical is/was it to fire this weapon from the hip?
3 - Is the Bren related in any way to the Sten other than a nicely rhyming name!?
4 - Is the Bren the Brit equivalent of the US BAR?

TIA

[Man_of_Stoat]

@arhob1

Some interesteing quotes in your first post Man of Stoat - thanks.

A few questions though:

1 - What did SMLE mean when he said “Of course, everyone knows you can’t use it past 300 metres…”? Does he mean that the tracer burns out after this range? Is this a typical range for tracer (the burn not the round of course)?
2 - The bren gun looks very heavy to me - how practical is/was it to fire this weapon from the hip?
3 - Is the Bren related in any way to the Sten other than a nicely rhyming name!?
4 - Is the Bren the Brit equivalent of the US BAR?

TIA

1-he was being sarcastic – it was an ironman reference. The distance for tracer burnout is 900 m plus, depending…
2-it weighs just over 10 kg.
3-only in that the “EN” in both cases stands for “Enfield”.
4-yes and no – the US never adopted a proper light machine gun. The BAR is a heavy automatic rifle, whereas the Bren is a proper light machine gun. The US attempted to fill the gap with the M1919A6 Browning, but that was far too heavy. See threads passim.

[X-Pence]

I see the BAR as a burden on a soldier, in the sence that they were used as a squad support weapon witch can move with the troops and they have a 20 round clip so its hardly going to supress an enemy without constant reloading and i suppose reloading a weapon like that might take a bit longer than reloading a bren.

[Firefly]

@X-Pence

I see the BAR as a burden on a soldier, in the sence that they were used as a squad support weapon witch can move with the troops and they have a 20 round clip so its hardly going to supress an enemy without constant reloading and i suppose reloading a weapon like that might take a bit longer than reloading a bren.

I dont agree. I think the BAR was much better than the Bren as its magazines were straight and the bullets didnt have to be bent to fit in it.

[Topor]

@X-Pence

I see the BAR as a burden on a soldier, in the sence that they were used as a squad support weapon witch can move with the troops and they have a 20 round clip so its hardly going to supress an enemy without constant reloading and i suppose reloading a weapon like that might take a bit longer than reloading a bren.

It’s not a “clip”, it’s a magazine - a “clip” is what was used to reload the M1 Garand & was ejected as expendable when empty.

[X-Pence]

@Firefly

[quote=X-Pence]I see the BAR as a burden on a soldier, in the sence that they were used as a squad support weapon witch can move with the troops and they have a 20 round clip so its hardly going to supress an enemy without constant reloading and i suppose reloading a weapon like that might take a bit longer than reloading a bren.

I dont agree. I think the BAR was much better than the Bren as its magazines were straight and the bullets didnt have to be bent to fit in it.[/quote]

You actuly think the bullets were bent, ha. It came as a shock when you said that.

The Bren would be easyer to reload than a BAR and Better at supporting troops in terms of accuracy and mag size.

[Man_of_Stoat]

@Firefly

[
I dont agree. I think the BAR was much better than the Bren as its magazines were straight and the bullets didnt have to be bent to fit in it.

Has ironman hacked your account? Or is this a Wah?