Operation Rosario. Background and aftermatch.

Other Wars Falklands/Malvinas War
#41

Yes I did read the text, I thought that was hilarious too.
The background music in the video clip was interesting, “God Save the Queen” by the Sex Pistols and later the theme from the Benny Hill Show. Unless it was also part of their wind-up, I thought it was a shame that the lads got the origin of ‘Benny’ wrong - still it’s been a long time since Crossroads was on.
On the whole I thought they succeeded 100% in getting a bite, the poor lass seemed to have taken it hook, line and sinker ! Must have made for some interesting chats back in the BA wine bars.

The voiceover at the end was telling - Mount Prison Airport.

Oh yeah - and the map ! :smiley: :smiley: :smiley:

#42

Apparently the youth of the Falklands islands live in a bubble created by the local press, manpulated to think that Argentina is the enemy and that they can only by saved by the British military. This is so that the evil British Government can dominate the South Atlantic for their own nefarious ends.

LR your translation is wrong , in no part of that page said that the British are evil.

Videos exclusivos… entrevista a los jóvenes malvinenses. ¿Qué piensan de los argentinos, de los militares ingleses homosexuales que habitan en las islas…? ¿cuánto le han dicho o enseñado a cerca de la guerra?
Según una entrevista realizada a los jóvenes malvinenses, en la escuela no le enseñan nada a cerca de la guerra de Malvinas, y todo lo que saben es gracias a sus padres, y que la mayoría de ellos desconfía de los argentinos, ya que toda la información que les llega a cerca de nuestro país, es tergiversada por la prensa de las islas.
En el segundo video, una entrevista al dueño de un bar nocturno de las islas, cuenta que una vez a la semana se realiza la “noche latina” y allí se pasa “cumbia villera”. Los isleños creen que es chilena y la bailan continuamente, desconocen que es argentina.

Exclusive videos…interview to the Malvinensis youth, what they think about the argentines, of the homosexual british military whom lives in the islands? . How much had been told or teach to them about the war ?
According to the interview with the kids in the school nothing is learned about the war and everything they know is for his parents mouth, and the majority of them did not trust the Argentines since the information about our country who reach the islands is twisted by the local media.

In the second video, a interview to the owner of a night bar of the islands, he tells that once a week the “latin night” is made and the “gansta cumbia” is played. The islanders believe that is chilean and they dance with it all the time, they didnt know that is from argentina.

Como vemos, la juventud malvinense vive en una verdadera burbuja, aislada del mundo real, manipulada por la prensa local que tiene por único objetivo hacerle creer a la población, que Argentina es un país sanguinario y malvado, cuya única salvación es la presencia de militares británicos.

As we see, the Malvinas youth live in a real bubble, aislated from the real world, manipulated by the local press with the only target to make believe that Argentina is a Evil and bloodthirsty country and their only salvation is the presence of the british military.

Nada le enseñan acerca de la guerra, ni de la historia de las islas. Nada dicen sobre las verdaderas intenciones argentinas ni del modo de vida de sus habitantes. Si se lograran romper las barreras de la desinformación, ambos pueblos podrían llevarse mejor, y sabrían, que desde este lado del continente, los argentinos respetamos su forma de vida, y no se verían perjudicados ante un eventual cambio de soberanía

Nothing is teached to them about the war and the islands history. Nothing is said about the truly Argentine intentions or the living way of his inhabitants. If the barriers of disinformation could be erased both peoples could get alone and they knew that in this side of the continent the Argentines respect their way of living and nothing will be interrupted in a eventual change in sovereign.

My note:

The concepts like “homosexual” applied to the british military belong to the authors of that ultra right wing/nationalist page… so make your reclamations to them.

#43

Actually my tongue in cheek comment about the evil British Government was referring to this little doozy:

Justamente, la presencia de los soldados ingleses, es la única excusa por la cual Gran Bretaña puede seguir dominando el archipiélago, sabe muy bien que los isleños no son capaces de tener una fuerza propia capaz de defenderse ante un ataque externo.

Which I translated as:

The continued presence of the English army, is the only excuse that Great Britain can use to continue dominating the archipelago, it knows that the islanders cannot have their own forces able to defend them against an external attack.

My Spanish is crap but I think I get the gist of it. My comment contained just a little hyperbole, which I guess doesn’t translate too well.

So back to my question, do people seriously believe this?

The notion that the Islanders are living in a bubble is nonesense, they have satellite TV, the Internet and free education overseas for A-levels. They can get information from many different sources, and the information they get from the web is unlikely to endear themselves to the Argentinians. For example when one of the Islanders posted a video of a commemoration of the Argentine invasion on YouTube, it was quickly filled with Argentinians posting comments about English Pirates, general abuse and threats to take the Islands back by force. Then they see stuff like this, what do you think is the impression that it will leave?

Ask yourself this, if a Falkland Islander were to frequent this forum and read some of the threads about who owns the islands, what impression would they take away?

#44

The invading Argentine forces were not exactly nice to the current Benny youth’s parents, and certainly did not respect their “way of living” (i.e. speaking English and driving on the left), so it’s hardly surprising that they view Argentina with suspicion. Plus what Lone Ranger said.

#45

I hate to ask questions in here coz everytime I do it seems like it start a shitstrom. BTW it was me that posted the first thread on the Falklands :roll:

Anyhoo…did any of the Islanders request assistance from Argentina or the UK? Might be getting off topic here so feel free to start a new thread on this!

#46

It might well be the subject for another thread, but I believe it would be one of the shortest on site.

For example, if I split the qustion:

Q.
Did any of the Islanders request assistance from:
a) Argentina.
b) The UK.

A.
a) No.
b) Yes.

#47

To Lone Ranger:

People being agressive in Youtube ?..hu…hardly a new. If the “Falklanders” are smart enough they will realize that 4 or 5 sixteen years old morons with broadband and poor english language skills did not represent Argentina.

If you think that the Argentine claim is nonsence… fine I respect your opinion even I dint share it, that does not mean I need to became a prick with you and viceversa. This is a perspective that some members still didnt fully understand

If something I learned in this last months is to do not discuss opinions because is helpless.

Ask yourself this, if a Falkland Islander were to frequent this forum and read some of the threads about who owns the islands, what impression would they take away?

I never, ever put in doubt the ownership of the islands. That would be very silly. Is pretty clear to me that in that actual circunstances the islands belong to the Kelpers.

Ask yourself this, if a Falkland Islander were to frequent this forum and read some of the threads about who owns the islands, what impression would they take away?

I dont know, but I can assure you that if those people meet me in person probably we will end drinking some beers togheter.

#48

Actually I never posted any question about who owns the islands, the question I asked was related to the site you posted. That claimed that part of the reason the Islanders were so hostile to Argentina was they were living in a bubble unaware of the benign intentions of the Argentinians (that was more hyperbole BTW just in case theres any confusion).

And I think you’re being just a little disingenuous in your reply, so in return I’ll elaborate. If you look on Argentine websites related to the Falklands, they’re usually (and I realise I’m generalising) completely dismissive that the Islanders have any rights. Read some of Eagle’s posts here about why the Islanders should simply be ignored.

Now take some of those writings and replace Falkland Islands with Argentina and ask yourself how you would feel?

Because its only by recognising that the aggressive stance your country takes on the issue is the factor in determining how the Islanders view Argentina that you might be able to reach some kind of detente with them. However, it seems that you as a nation just can’t accept that and to be honest the way you’ve dodged the question kinda demonstrates my point.

BTW I’m not much of a beer drinker but I’m sure we could crack a bottle of Malbec together.

#49

If you look on Argentine websites related to the Falklands, they’re usually (and I realise I’m generalising) completely dismissive that the Islanders have any rights. Read some of Eagle’s posts here about why the Islanders should simply be ignored.

No this site I ve posted, Eagle should respond by himself about his posted opinions, I cannot, I simply can say that I do not agree with him.

Now take some of those writings and replace Falkland Islands with Argentina and ask yourself how you would feel?

I feel very amused by the disbalanced comparative, Argentina had never made a war for gaining territory.

Because its only by recognising that the aggressive stance your country takes on the issue is the factor in determining how the Islanders view Argentina that you might be able to reach some kind of detente with them. However, it seems that you as a nation just can’t accept that and to be honest the way you’ve dodged the question kinda demonstrates my point.

I try to do not “dodge” any question but simply I cannot answers thing I dont know.

If the position of Argentina ( and I mean todays Argentina 2007) is perceived as “agressive” then that website was right, the local/british media twisted the things.

BTW I’m not much of a beer drinker but I’m sure we could crack a bottle of Malbec together.

Oh man , you cannot be more right, I didnt like too much the beer also, I just named a drink popular to the islanders because you know, I respect their way of living :mrgreen:, but I agree nothing can surpass a good wine, and If argentine Malbec better.

#50

On 02/04/07, Argentina renewed its claim to the Falklands, and over the past few years has been very pushy to open sovereignty negotiations. Maybe they are not being currently militarily aggressive towards the Falklands, but they are politically.

Frankly, the rights of self-determination of the fifth generation islanders far outweighs any historical claim dating back to pre-1833 from Argentina, Spain, or indeed France.

#51

Apart from the 1982 invasion of the Falkland Islands and the territorial disputes with your neighbours. Correct me if I’m wrong but Argentina refused to relinquish territory in the Beagle Channel awarded to Chile by arbitration?

Quod erat demonstrandum.

#52

There was no war with Chile dear Lone Ranger.

And note that I use the word gaining not “regaining” territory. similar is not the same. :rolleyes:

#53

And note that I use the word gaining not “regaining” territory. similar is not the same.

Can we have Ireland and most of France back then?

Arguing semantics here is going to get you at the bottom of a very deep hole. “Regaining” is a subset of “gaining”…

#54

With the greatest respect, that seems a little limited. :smiley:

What about India, Burma, Malaya, Singapore, and large slabs of the Middle East?

Not to mention America, which was lost only about half a century before Argentina didn’t establish a claim to the Falklands in 1833.

What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. :smiley:

Oops!

Sorry.

That’d mean that Spain gets Argentina back. Although, on historical titles, without the Falklands.

Bit of a bugger, that. :smiley:

#55

Legally binding arbitration through the ICJ awarded the territory to Chile, Argentina refused to accept it. It came close to war in 1978, largely it has to be said, because of Argentina’s aggressive behaviour.

I notice the ICJ ruled against you in the case you brought over Uruguyan paper mills, Mercosur ruled against you. Hasn’t stopped the blockades or harassment of Uruguyan lorries passing through Argentina has it?

There are numerous examples of Argentinian Governments acting aggressively toward the Falkland Islands - I’ve already listed a few.

No doubt, in your mind Argentine intentions were entirely benevolent and they were just misunderstood. Just out of interest, are you aware of Orwell’s concept of Doublethink?

#56

Almost agree with you (even I dont know what is the relationship with the Parana ecological protest) there was frictions, but still there was no war with Chile.

Arguing semantics here is going to get you at the bottom of a very deep hole.

I am so scared¡¡¡¡¡¡¡ What i am going to do ¡¡¡¡¡:!:

No worry about me MoS , my problem would be is somebody begin to behave like an asshole :rolleyes:

#57

Quod erat démōnstrandum.

	▼

I am so scared¡¡¡¡¡¡¡ What i am going to do ¡¡¡¡¡:!:[/QUOTE]

#58

Oh…nice example, you got me there, but I am not the first in behave like this.:smiley:

And knowing the quality of some members, (2 gentlemen in particular) I wont be the last.

#59

I’ll not watch the vidoe wrt to the Falklands occupants.

I will point out a few things though…

Having been on the Falklands recently, something many of you on this site have never been, so I can point out a few things first hand.

The “Falklands Bubble”… The Islanders have never been more connected to the world.

Gone are the days when the Army brought videos of BFBS for the children. Many homes now have sattelite TV and phones (something they didn’t have in '82), radios are still used for comms between the more remote sites.

Internet is also available.

Many children leave the Islands for their education, in the UK or other International schools.

If you are upset about the views of the parents on the Argientines, unlucky. No amount of bubbledom or not, will change their views. Read the first hand account on my Land Rovers thread for what happened at Goose Green to the people there.

Things like that stick, as do forcing an alien tongue on the Islanders, forcing changes in laws (ie road traffic acts), forceably evicting members of the community.

Then of course there are minor details like the minefields and other detrious of war that were left behind (mainly by the Argies).

Then there are the defenders that have been left behind. There is a bit of a love/hate relationship between the Bennys and the forces. I think they much preferred the 30 odd garrison of the old boat party 8901. The Argentine invasion put paid to that.

If the Argentines are agreived that the Islanders don’t like them, well they shouldn’t have cut about the Islands like they owned them in '82 shoud they.

The homosexual claims are just rubbish. Lots of men, not many women - hence the claims. British Soldiers say the same about the Royal Navy/Marines at sea. The Islanders would no doubt have said the same about the Argentines had they some how stayed after 1982…

Ha ha, yes I know we are in the realms of fantasy there, but just supposing… HA HA HA HA no really…

As for this…

The true Argentine intentions are what? You (as in the Argentines) had a chance to win over the people in 1982, and you failed miserably. Particularly when you allowed the various bullies from your own countries “intelligence” (read “muderous scum”) services to the islands.

Given that you forced them to change their language, change their traffic laws etc etc. The islanders are hardly going to beleive that you will leave them in peace. They want to live as they do now, Britain provides that stability, the Argies can promise it but history has shown how they have and may treat the islanders.

Sorry Panzer, whinge and moan all you like about how the Islanders mistrust your country, it was YOUR country who did that, not any writings or claims by any other country.

Lay the blame for the situation wrt Argie/Falkland Islanders relations fully on your own step.

Even the fact you would change the name of their home offends.

#60

A very nice photo of a very nice ship.

In the series of mysterious Panzerknacker photos cunningly inserted to make subtle points in Falklands threads, I think this one is meant to demonstrate that:

(a) Argentina likes to force-feed its ships through big shore pipes, or

(b) Argentina lacks deep water ports, or

(c) Argentina has deep water ports but no captains capable of navigating them, so they just ground their ships on waveless beaches. Sort of the reverse of having a deep water ship like the Belgrano but no captain capable of keeping it off ocean floor.

:smiley: